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snottlebocket
28-04-2013, 22:38
Am I correct in understanding that the placing monsters rule means that most of the time the warriors get two chances to strike down monsters before they retaliate? Once on the turn when the monsters get placed, since they don't attack that turn and once again the next turn because warrior combat precedes monster combat. Does a sudden event when the wizard rolls a 1 also cause the monsters to give up their attack on the turn they get placed?

We played our first game tonight and the warriors pretty much breezed through the dungeon because they smashed everything aside before it got the chance to attack. Until the objective room anyway when I got swarmed by three minotaurs, four orc warriors and six orc archers. That said, our dungeon did seem to resemble a vermin infested cellar more than a proper dungeon. We encountered in sequence 5 rats, 7 spiders, 10 bats, a cave in, a portculis and a small hand full of skaven on the way to the objective room. Hardly stiff resistance.

How do archers get placed exactly? Do they get shared equally among the warriors and then get placed furthest from their target? In our game the archers did more damage than anything. With the minotaurs and orcs blocking my warrior's path, the archers quickly whittled them down with 3 points of damage per hit at range. The minotaurs never landed a blow but those archers scythed through my warriors while the mino's blocked them.

S_A_T_S
29-04-2013, 00:38
Yeah, that's not right - monsters are placed during the monster phase, which comes after the warriors phase, so in sequence:

1) Power Phase - Wizard rolls dice, 1 is unexpected event (if you get monsters, you place them now)
2) Warriors Phase - All warriors can move and act, attacking monster if there are any nearby
3) Monster Phase - If the warriors have entered a new dungeon room not corridor, at this point flip the top event card and place any monsters/carry out any event. Any monsters already on the board at the beginning of the phase get to move and act, attacking any warriors nearby.
4) Exploration Phase - If the warrior carrying the lantern is next to an unopened door, flip the next dungeon card.
5) Death Phase - According to the original rules, any warrior on 0 or less wounds at this point is dead and out of the game.

When we place archers, we place them as far as possible away within line of sight (so within the lantern range of two rooms). Archers can get out of hand when you can't get through the big bodies. This is what wizards are for ;-)

snottlebocket
29-04-2013, 08:17
Yeah, that's not right - monsters are placed during the monster phase, which comes after the warriors phase, so in sequence:

1) Power Phase - Wizard rolls dice, 1 is unexpected event (if you get monsters, you place them now)
2) Warriors Phase - All warriors can move and act, attacking monster if there are any nearby
3) Monster Phase - If the warriors have entered a new dungeon room not corridor, at this point flip the top event card and place any monsters/carry out any event. Any monsters already on the board at the beginning of the phase get to move and act, attacking any warriors nearby.
4) Exploration Phase - If the warrior carrying the lantern is next to an unopened door, flip the next dungeon card.
5) Death Phase - According to the original rules, any warrior on 0 or less wounds at this point is dead and out of the game.

When we place archers, we place them as far as possible away within line of sight (so within the lantern range of two rooms). Archers can get out of hand when you can't get through the big bodies. This is what wizards are for ;-)

I see where I went wrong. We played monsters forfeit their attack if they'd been placed that turn, not that phase. So unexpected event monsters (power roll of 1) weren't there at the start of that turn and didn't get to fight that turn. We should have realized they were placed by the time the monster phase rolled around and should have been able to fight. Which means heroes never get more than one free punch.

Doesn't that make monsters crazy lethal? Most monsters have a strength equal or almost equal to the toughness of our heroes, which means even the lowliest goblin will strike for about d6 damage each. At that power level it only takes a few punches to take a level 1 hero out. I did a quick solo game this morning to internalize your rules explanation and out of 3 attempts I never made it past the second board section before heroes started dropping dead. Just a lone bat with a lucky dice roll halved my wizards health.

Another question, how does attacking across board sections work? At some point one member was lagging slightly behind and standing on the left side of the doorway while the rest of the party was adjacent to him on the next board section on the other side of the doorway when monsters attacked. We drew a counter and all the monsters got placed on the board section around the lagging elf (there's a lesson in there somewhere). Two other warriors were adjacent to monsters but on the next board section, ie. the monsters on one side of the door, warriors on the other side. Can the warriors strike them? We assumed yes because we couldn't find anything to the contrary... and then the portcullis came down the next turn.

Which leads me to my last question. Does a doorway count as a square? It's almost exactly 1 square wide.

Anyway, archers are by far the scariest thing we encountered. A small group of them can scythe down heroes in one turn.

Frogczar
29-04-2013, 13:44
Doesn't that make monsters crazy lethal? Most monsters have a strength equal or almost equal to the toughness of our heroes, which means even the lowliest goblin will strike for about d6 damage each. At that power level it only takes a few punches to take a level 1 hero out. I did a quick solo game this morning to internalize your rules explanation and out of 3 attempts I never made it past the second board section before heroes started dropping dead. Just a lone bat with a lucky dice roll halved my wizards health.
.

Yes. Be ready to die early and often. Without the wizard, or a healing character of some kind, you will die.

But it's great fun!

snottlebocket
29-04-2013, 14:41
Yes. Be ready to die early and often. Without the wizard, or a healing character of some kind, you will die.

But it's great fun!

IŽll probably house rule everyone some bandages to start out with. My group are all non GW players, I donŽt think theyŽll keep steaming ahead on nostalgia after the first few party wipes.

S_A_T_S
29-04-2013, 19:03
Doesn't that make monsters crazy lethal?
Yep - welcome to WHQ.


Just a lone bat with a lucky dice roll halved my wizards health.
It's all about tactics and working together to start. Like Frgoczar says, you have to keep the wizard protected (and give him Healing Hands). We normally make sure the wizard doesn't go last so that he can get into the corner of a dungeon room and the other characters can form a wall around him, preventing any monster getting base-2-base with him.


We drew a counter and all the monsters got placed on the board section around the lagging elf (there's a lesson in there somewhere).
Monsters have to be placed evenly - we take each type (i.e. goblin spearmen and archers are two separate types) and spread them so as much as possible the same number of each type are attacking each hero. Any excess or odd monsters you use the counters to assign (i.e. 5 spearmen on 4 characters, 1 spearman on each and the last is counter-assigned). You can do the same to find who is NOT being attacked (i.e. 3 minotaurs turn up, pick a counter to find out which lucky sod doesn't get hammered).


Which leads me to my last question. Does a doorway count as a square?
I don't play it as taking up a square, and I haven't met any other people who do, but I think there are a few custom board builders on these forums who have built doors big enough that they count them as squares. In the end it's up to you as GM/game owner.

Inandantia
29-04-2013, 20:14
Most people will tell you that warriors in WHQ have a very low life expectancy for their first dungeon, in the spirit of things it's part of the fun but can put off new players depending on what they're used to. Once you've gotten through the first dungeon, gathered a few treasures each and bought some gear the second dungeon is more survivable. House ruling a few bandages each is a good idea along with making sure the wizard has healing hands (and possibly freeze as his attack spell) to improve chances. Another suggestion I've seen, which I like the sound of but have never tried, is to have unexpected events occur on a 6 instead of a 1.

In response to your questions S_A_T_S has got it spot on. I don't count doors as taking a space either but if you'd prefer to do so I can't imagine it altering the game drastically.

snottlebocket
29-04-2013, 20:28
Monsters have to be placed evenly - we take each type (i.e. goblin spearmen and archers are two separate types) and spread them so as much as possible the same number of each type are attacking each hero. Any excess or odd monsters you use the counters to assign (i.e. 5 spearmen on 4 characters, 1 spearman on each and the last is counter-assigned). You can do the same to find who is NOT being attacked (i.e. 3 minotaurs turn up, pick a counter to find out which lucky sod doesn't get hammered).


Page 15 explains that all monsters go on a single board section. So if the party is split across two board sections as ours was (elf in one room, the rest in the other), you draw a counter and place the monsters on the appropriate board section, all of them.

So our unlucky elf ended up fighting 10 giant bats, the wizard couldn't freeze the bats since he was right next to the elf but on the next board section and before the barbarian and dwarf could rush to his aid, the portculis came crashing down. Those bats laid out a fiendish trap, executed with military precision.

As it turned out those bats found their match in that elf considering he turned into a whirlwind of destruction and death blows. But still, a nasty situation.

Daemonslave
30-04-2013, 21:20
It's also worth pointing out that before the Power Roll is made there is a Declaration Phase where the Warriors say what they are going to do the next turn. If they are going to search for treasure for example and the Monsters turn up then they are not allowed to attack them unless they pass an initiative test (otherwise they are completely taken by surprise!)

BigRob
30-04-2013, 21:44
This is also where monsters with the Ambush rule get to have fun, check the roleplay book for the full gory details.

I advise starting everyone with D6 Bandages, just in case.