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Mad Doc Grotsnik
19-06-2006, 19:27
Another (hopefully) quality thread from the pondering depths of my diseased mind (no really. It is. I've had EEGs, MRIs and am still waiting for the results!)

Something really bugs me on Warseer. And thats the number of self proclaimed Veteran gamers. It strikes me that the Veteran label is highly desirable amongst us gaming weirdos, and to boot, often self proclaimed.

Many times I have seen posters (myself included to be brutally honest) expect their opinions and comments to have greater gravitas due to their length of service in the Hobby. Now, the above isn't necessarily untrue. I think it's unfair to expect a Newbie to know lots of tactical Nuances. Hell, it's often a lot to expect them to know the difference between Orcs and Orks!

But at some point, we cease to be Noobs. Again, at which point is very much a grey area. However, there is something of a false assumption that to not be a Noob, is to be a Veteran. And as you might be able to tell by the above wording, I'm not exactly in agreement with that assumption. Now, Games Workshop themselves have not 2, but 3 categories of Gamer. Beginners (NooBS!) Veterans (Greying Gits!) and....CORE Gamers (it doesn't stand for anything, I just put in capitals because I don't know how to do italics!).

Now, even GWs definitions of where a Core gamer ends and a Veteran gamer begins is wonderously vague. The old Veterans club was for gamers over the age of 16. But this doesn't mean everyone in attendance is a world weary wargamer with buckets of experience. It's more a term to indicate that kiddywinks won't be in attendance, and it's a green light to enjoy a game amongst people closer to your own age.

But enough random gibberish, it's time for why *I* consider myself to be a Veteran. I shall break it down into seperate points. Please note, that I am not attempting to set any particular parameters for Veterandom, just explaining why I consider myself one.

1. I have been playing the various games since I was 10. Thats 16 years of Wargaming goodness!

2. I 'major' in both Warhammer and Warhammer 40,000, and have, or have had, several armies for both.

3. I have worked for Games Workshop not once, but twice (Keytime)

4. I make a point of procuring every army book as it comes out, so I have the entire collection at my fingertips should I ponder something.

5. Not only do I play the current big two, but I have played, or at least dabbled, in every Games Workshop game since Tyranid Attack, with varying degrees of success (good as I am at most, I suck royally at Blood Bowl!)

So, thats why I consider myself to be a Veteran. My combined experiences mean I have a wide variety of skills which I am happy to pass on.

Now it's your turn to discuss, and if you consider yourself a Veteran, then say why!

Okuto
19-06-2006, 19:37
I don't consider myself a vet, I'm just bloodied I suppose, most of the Vets I know often share these traits

-Own more than one army
-Played at least one camp
-Played at at least two tournaments
-Played against every single army at least once
-Usually have at least 2 years exp
-Often know alot about the different armies even though they don't own them
-Often have armies bigger than 2k
-Take losing very well and often ponder why
-Great sportsmanship

I'd like to consider myself a vet at fantasy but I feel like I don't have the right to say that just yet

Str10_hurts
19-06-2006, 19:38
Its all about how high you set the bar.

For what it is worth I consider myself a gamer because I've had 8+ years, had memorised every codex in 3rd ed. and organise tournaments (small ones) and do painting tutorials for kids/adolecents and im a not that bad player. And alway's calm in a game, and do not moan about rules.

Still I am only a n00b compared to people that have been around for 25+ years and have every army in the 2 mayor games.

Wraithbored
19-06-2006, 19:39
I am not vet. Far from it but one thing a vet needs to be good at is: He needs to know how to handle defeat well.

jfrazell
19-06-2006, 19:43
Some signs you're a "vet."

-If you have models that are older than your opponent.

-When you say the "old speeder" you mean the one where the riders' legs hung off the speeder.

-You bought Space Hulk, when it was new, in the store.

-You are convinced that was the best GW game ever made.

-You remember fondly your farseer ally for your Space Wolf army.

-When you started you had a curfew imposed by your parents. Now you have a curfew imposed by your children.

-Your own son beats your brains in with his new 18 asscannon+ list.

-Three words: SHOKK ATTACK GUN. Best weapon ever conceived on fluff or action.

-You think back to when Assault Cannons were REALLY tough - 2nd edition when you could fire them 9 times.

boogle
19-06-2006, 19:43
I've been in the hobby since 1992, but i don't think i'm a veteran for the following reasons:
I only really started gaming when i joined GW
I have had a few armies, but only ever fully painted 2
My Painting isn't great
My knowledge of the rules has grown hazier since i left the company
I only manage about 12 games a year

Death Cat
19-06-2006, 19:44
As far as im concerned im a "Gamer" nothing more nothing less, ive played since i was 14 and i will be 21 next monday (dear god eight years, how the time flies). Even now im learning new tactics, painting technics ect and i expect i will for years to come. Infact part of the fun is in the learning. As far as im concerned you could have nine years experience or ninety-nine its all about the learning. Learning and challenging yourself to do better and to teach others.

Brimstone
19-06-2006, 19:52
Don't we already have another thread (http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37064l) on this very subject that you are posting on Mad Doc we really don't need another.

I'm also moving this one to 'other GW discussion' as it's not 40K specific.

Getz
19-06-2006, 22:56
-Played at at least two tournaments



I don't see that the desire to take part in Tournaments (a relatively recent invention) is the mark of a Veteran.

I like to think of myself as a bit of a Vet (if I'm honest with myself) but I have very littel desire to take part in "organised" competition. I occasionally stretch to Club Tournament play, but I'd never go to a GT...

That doesn't mean I'm not a Veteran Gamer.

To be honest, I think the Status of Veteran is only something you can have conferred upon you, it's not something you can claim for yourself. You're a Veteran when all other Gamers you know think you are...

swordwind
19-06-2006, 23:01
Well I'm 17 now and I've been collecting, reading and painting GW's stuff since I was........ 5!!! I cant even remember why or how but I remember I was on holiday in a caravan and I'd bought a box of the "clone" wood elves and the old old old plastic Chaos Warriors, the ones with the big axe and static hand on hip pose. I remember spending the last of my holiday money on my first White Dwarf (issue 199). I also used to call Warhammer "the medieval one" (I'm quite proud I knew what Medieval meant when I was 5) and 40k "the spaceship one".


And I still dont know all the rules!

So where I would be ranked in the noob-vetran scale I dont know

MechTau
20-06-2006, 00:13
I have a very loose definition of veteran.

A veteran is someone who can make a list that works well. A veteran has the rulebook memorized, and has extensive fluff knowledge. A veteran knows more about his enemie's army than his noob oponent.

Veterans can paint well, and have a fully painted army.

Other people ask vets for help.

(Shokk attack gun was wicked!)

Phunting
20-06-2006, 00:28
I would say the main quality that a vet has is the ability to complain that things aren't as good in the game as when they started playing.

Therefore I think the criteria to be regarded as one is to have started playing the game in a previous edition, preferably at least two editions ago...

Tyra_Nid
20-06-2006, 01:01
I dont think being a 'Vet' has too much to do with time spent in the hobby. I know one of the guys in my club that I would consider a Veteran, and he only started during LotR (isnt that game new!?). He plays in tournaments and is a superb WHFB player.

Even though Ive been wargaming longer than him, I would say that when it comes to fantasy at least (Ive only recently got back into fantasy this edition, after not playing for the last couple) he surpasses me in 'Vet Hood' in that game.

As someone mentioned earlier, I believe it would be when other people consider you a Vet, not when you consider yourself one.

Killgore
20-06-2006, 02:08
Veteran hood is all in the mind, just like being "cool" is

I been playing since I was 10, thats 10/11 years ago, I regualry forget rules, dont paint alot of my stuff, collect to many armys but master none, have a giant pile of white drawfs but cant remember which article is in which, dont go to tourneys and generaly talk ******** in forums like this

so i ask myself, am I a vet?

starlight
20-06-2006, 02:53
Kneel before Zod, pathetic n00bs!

Post count is all!:evilgrin:




Seriously people, it's all in your behaviour - while *I* consider myself somewhat of a Vet, it doesn't *mean* anything. All that matters is whether or not people will game with me.:D If they'll game, great. If not, :(. What they call me isn't relevant. Hopefully *worthy opponent* will figure in there somewhere.:D

Morph
23-06-2006, 11:01
I think you're a vet when you realise that GW are an evil money-grabbing corporation, but at the same time you're too addicted and can't stop giving them your cash.

Dr Death
23-06-2006, 12:27
That counts me in then morph:rolleyes:.

I dont think veteran is something you can pin a definition on, it is subjective. I look at myself when i say this- I've been collecting miniatures and reading everything i can find on GW stuff for about 8 years but that is about my sum total of gaming experience. I rarely paint any more, i've only ever managed one reasonably fully painted army in those many years. I havnt entered a tourny, i rarely game. I've read the rulebooks more times cover to cover than the number of games i've had in my entire hobby career.

It's relative, rather than being some kind of jackpot you hit after you've collected 3 fully painted armies, entered a tournie, run a campaign, and made your own board entitling you access to some kind of gentlemens club. I consider myself a "veteran of the hobby" rather than a Veteran hobbyist. To someone new to the hobby i may well be what they could consider a "veteran" simply by virtue of the time i've been in the hobby and the attention to the shifting tides of GW's advance. However compared to someone like Brandir, Shadowheart or Pertinax, simply by virtue of my lack of years (being a wee slip of 17) i dont think i could conceivably call myself a veteran stood next to such pillars of hobbydom. Age while not seemingly important plays some part in a relative person's "veteraness" regardless of how many years someone who counts their age on their hands may have been exposed to the hobby.

So veteran isnt nearly as easy to pin down as people would like, nor is it as easy to knock off "who isnt" a veteran. However i suppose there is such thing as the "traditional veteran" which others have outlined, being the late 20's "been here since rouge trader", multiple armies, more rulebooks than your age type blokey. Whether that is the "definative veteran" is an altogether different matter.

Dr Death

gortexgunnerson
23-06-2006, 12:45
I would go with a combination of age and length of gaming hobby. I think older players become more what I would believe Vets to be then younger ones. I think the beer explanation should be applied.

As a young player some might argue you have less posibilities in your social life i.e. you can't get into the pub and womanise lol. Once past the age when you can get into the pub and still keep gaming you classify as a vet because you prefer a nights gaming to that of beer and womanising lol

Of course the fine art is combining the 2, we used to go to our Vets night in nottignham and then go on a drinking bender every tuesday night, was a great laugh couple of games then a lot of beer and warhammer chat!

Deathjester
23-06-2006, 12:54
I'm a vet, i've been playing since i was 12? i think, but that was 11 years ago.

I've played just about every game that GW have produced. Not that i like lord of the rings.......

I've played in quite a lot of tournaments and placed reasonably highly in most of them.

I currently own, 5 40k armies, & 5 fantasy armies. Of which 1 of each is more than 3000pts.
Space wolves are verging on 12,000pts. yes 12k
Wood Elves verging on 4,500pts.

Other than that I play regularly (once a week at least), I know all my Gw staff, and they know me just as well. (We're all friends here).

My knowledge exends over armies i don't & have never owned. I read the army books for fun when i don't have anything else to read.

But mainly i make army lists for fun. I love it. The only problem with that is when i come up with one i really like i general buy it.

Bob Hunk
23-06-2006, 12:59
This is a disgustingly good question. I consider myself to be a veteran and as far as I'm aware I'm considered to be veteran by my peers. It was interesting to see what everyone else considered to be the criteria for veteran-hood, some I'd say applied to me (Go Shokk Attack Gun! My legs; full of Snotlings! Oh the humanity!), and others clearly don't (I've never been to a tournament, nor would I wish to).

This lead me to consider the following: At what point did I consider myself to be a veteran?

I learnt to play in the twilight days of Rogue Trader (1st edition), but I don't remember considering myself a veteran during 2nd edition. I realised it wasn't until 3rd edition came out that I actually began to feel like a veteran. So if we want a simple answer then I guess I agree with some of the previous posters - being able to remember back at least two editions makes you a veteran! :D In reality though, I suspect being a veteran is all in the mind...

Perhaps another way of looking at it would be: Have you ever encountered someone who considered themselves to be a veteran, but you disagreed? If so, why? :)

lord_blackfang
23-06-2006, 13:48
I don't really know either. It seems a lot of local gamers consider me a 40k vet, as they make a big deal about me attending tournaments and such, have made me the judge and acknowledge me as the premier 40k rules expert in the country (it's a very small country)

Thinking about the people I myself consider vets, and why, I guess the most important factor would be "knows what he's doing and what he's talking about." They know the rules and the fluff inside out, have a good grasp of tactics, can objectively analyze and predict a unit's tabletop performance and balance just by looking at the army list, and have a mature attitude towards the game.

The Ape
23-06-2006, 14:44
It should be something that is bestowed upon you by others and not based on your own opinions.

Kinda like the rank of jedi master - you must be voted in as such by your peers.

Alternatively, who cares? It doesnt mean anything, nor does it grant you special powers. Doesnt even mean you can attend "vets nites" as you only have to be 16+ to do that.

Bob Hunk
23-06-2006, 14:46
Thinking about the people I myself consider vets ... (snip) ... have a mature attitude towards the game.

Ah-ha, I think Lord Blackfang may well have hit the nail on the head there. Years of gaming, painting and general hobby experience is nothing without a mature attitude to back in up. :)

athamas
23-06-2006, 18:20
i would not say im a vet.. i have been playing this game for almost 10 years..

have collected a multitude of armies, know far to much about lots of background.. but still know i know very little when some subjects are are bought up...

maybe when they bring out 5th ed. i might consider myself a vet.. but untill then i just have experience!

FireDeth
23-06-2006, 18:23
Ah-ha, I think Lord Blackfang may well have hit the nail on the head there. Years of gaming, painting and general hobby experience is nothing without a mature attitude to back in up. :)

Good point!

EvC
23-06-2006, 20:06
Veteran - someone who remembers White Dwarf being a great read ;)

If only I were joking...

Damien 1427
23-06-2006, 21:04
When you feel GW owes you something, and proceed to tell this to everyone within earshot, then you are a grumpy old sod. Or a veteran. Same different, really. :p

Luke
25-06-2006, 12:14
You are a veteran the day you realise that GW is not the be-all and end-all of Wargaming and that there are far far better and cheaper companies with much better rules and support out there.

Wait, are we talking vet GW gamers or just vet wargamers in general? Caus there is a difference. GW is just like Macdonalds, just because you eat there everyday doesnt mean you know what "petit-pois" are.

A veteran Wargamer should probably own more than 2 editions of at least 2 wargames from at least 2 different companies and have played for at least 10 years. Simply collecting 3 space marine armies over 5 years and knowing what a squat is does not entitle you to think you know your wargames.

The Ape
25-06-2006, 13:19
Maybe being a vet gamer is when you are elitist about the other types of wargames you play, and sneer down at anyone who only plays GW games? :rolleyes:

Luke
25-06-2006, 13:23
Maybe being a vet gamer is when you are elitist about the other types of wargames you play, and sneer down at anyone who only plays GW games? :rolleyes:

You know, I spent literally minutes thinking of a reply for this but in the end I just thought I'd let it slip. Re-read my last post if you want a response.

Mad Doc Grotsnik
25-06-2006, 14:28
Well, you did, intentionally or not, suggest that those who only play GW games are not 'proper' gamers. There have been posters on these boards before who had just that opinion!

But I see what you mean, even if I don't agree with you!

Luke
25-06-2006, 14:34
Well thats the confrontational way to look at it. I dont recall saying GW gamers were not proper gamers, I merely suggested that they need to broaden their horizons and try out a few much better games instead.

You cant seriously label yourself as a veteran gamer if you have only played 40k for the last 20 years.

The Winslow
25-06-2006, 14:45
You obviously wouldn't, but the person playing for 20 years might.

Mad Doc Grotsnik
25-06-2006, 14:45
Why not though? Not everyone has access to these other games. I've dabbled in Warmachine once. I found it a bit powergamey to my tastes.

A game I do enjoy playing from time to time in Samurai Blades, which I believe Cade and I picked up a bootfair some 17 years ago. Is a fantastic game set in Feudal Japan, yet because I can't find suitable models (perhaps I'm not looking hard enough!) I'm stuck using the cardboard counters that came with.

And what makes a game better? Improved realism? GW does Fantasy games very well. Cheaper models? Yes and no, depending on the relative quality...

It's quite a statement you've made, and I would like to explore it a bit.

Luke
25-06-2006, 14:53
It's quite a statement you've made, and I would like to explore it a bit.

Be my guest. Keep it civil though.

Mad Doc Grotsnik
25-06-2006, 14:57
Not being funny, but that was your cue!

Sir_Turalyon
25-06-2006, 15:00
Back to the topic: I define veteran as anyone playing longer then myself. That simple. Obviously, I am not a veteran.

Another definition is, you are a veteran when you realise wargaming is not what it used to be. But then, almost everyone is veteran :).

Luke
25-06-2006, 15:01
Not being funny, but that was your cue!

Yeah but I really dont have the patience for a drawn out debate. What it will all boil down to in the end is: You are right, so am I. We will mill over the same thoughts for a few pages and then no-one would have made any difference. :D

Feel free to pick at the topic though, if it gets heated I may step in and have a poke.

The Ape
25-06-2006, 18:59
I was merely trying to spark an interesting discussion as 4 pages of "Im a vet because..." was getting boring and yours was the first comment that wasnt a bog standard response.

Kudos on letting your original reply slip by.

Im not a vet cos i dont stick my hand up cows arses...

Captain Rufus
27-06-2006, 10:30
Im just a long time gamer. Started tabletop games in 88, bought Rogue Trader in 91, started playing 40K in 94-95, and have played at various levels of devotion ever since.
Ive played 40K, Epic, Fantasy, Necromunda, Blood Bowl, Heroquest, and Space Crusade, and keep meaning to get around to Tyranid Attack and Space Hulk.
(My playing amount has dropped since 3rd ed 40K though.)
I have nearly every Rogue Trader era 40K book except for Astronomicon and Vehicle Manual as far as I can tell, and for a while I had every 3rd edition army book till I realised that was a waste of money, even for fluff.

Perhaps I am a veteran, perhaps not.

Who knows?

ex-green
28-06-2006, 11:39
What makes a vet you ask!
Well I have played and collected 40K since 1989 and have had a fully painted army of each and every race brought out except Squats. Along with owing every codex thats come out just to see what any opponent will have and every rule book and supplement since Rouge Trader.
I have six gangs for Necromunda,two fleets for Gothic, an Inquisitor warband, three Epic armies, and forces of good and evil for LOTR.
I have Space Hulk,Deathwing, Genestealer, Space Crusade, Heroquest, Advanced Heroquest.
Although I missed out on Dark Future,Gorkamorka, Advanced Space Crusade and Confuntration.
Does that qualify I dont know but I make a point of only fielding fully painted forces and knowing as many of the rules for the system I am playing and even the I get it wrong sometimes.
A veteran gamer is such a subjective thing only you can decide!!!!

IJW
28-06-2006, 12:31
I think that as well as veteran ("someone who's been playing forever") there's another category (to which I belong) of "played for a bit a long time ago, gave it up in favour of wine, women and song (i.e. university) now getting back into it"
Make that at least two of us...

Jellicoe
28-06-2006, 13:36
As people have said a subjective term that can apply to all sorts of situations

I guess I would be a vet because of my length of service

Warhammer 1st ed
Rogue Trader
Space Hulk
Dwarf reader from issue 60ish

also play a multitude of other historical wargames and occaisionally when the opportunity presents a dash of Call of Cthulhu and AD&D

so on the basis that I have been playing with various representations of toy soldeirs for 25+ years I am a vet. If a vet means actually being any good at such games, well that is a different matter altogether!

McMullet
28-06-2006, 13:42
Playing for 25 years and not winning much indicates you play for the right reasons - I'd say that has as much to do with being a veteran as the length of time you've been playing for.

One of my friends has been playing for 12 years or so and he still throws his models at the wall when they run away. He could play for another 13 years and he'd still be a n00b... :rolleyes:

Jellicoe
28-06-2006, 14:17
losing - yup
model throwing - no way! Too valuable and too much time and money invested, besides after that amount of time I like to think I have just about mastered my 12 year old hormone driven temper tantrums!!

The Winslow
28-06-2006, 15:16
Had a friend play a game at a GW store. This was against an adult player, who supposedly was staying on top of the board with his Empire gun line. When his army started getting whipped, he started throwing his models at my friends Dryads, actually breaking and chipping some models, and not even apologizing.

Commissar von Toussaint
03-07-2006, 16:44
All titles are relative.

A decade ago I was still thought up as somewhat of a newbie - despite having more than 10 years of gaming experience. But I was the youngest in the group, you see, so that made me the "new guy."

Now that distinction doesn't matter so much since we're all moving into middle age and have kids. Indeed, our kids are the newbies.

But it's all relative.

If you started playing when 3rd came out, you're a veteran to someone who just bought 4th.

If you started with 2nd, as I did, your friends who bought Rogue Trader consider you a youngster.

You see this all the time in the military. A buck sergeant really doesn't have a ton of rank - unless you're a brand-new private. Same with gaming.

Of course, you know what the first Marine to enlist said to the second one: "You should have seen the old Corps when I joined. Now these new standards...." :)

carmachu
03-07-2006, 17:09
You've played through 3 different editions of the game.....40k or fantasy.....


I love the space hulk comment.......

jfrazell
03-07-2006, 18:40
Make that at least two of us...

Make that three of us.

marv335
03-07-2006, 18:49
i see veteran status as a state of mind rather than an age/experience level.
some people have been playing for years and yet still behave like petulant children. some new players act with a good knowledge of the rules and behave in a sporting and considerate manner toward their opponents despite being young.

as i see it, being a Vet is something that you earn by your behavior rather than your age.

snurl
04-07-2006, 05:53
Experience.

Witch Hunter
04-07-2006, 06:01
Some signs you're a "vet."

-If you have models that are older than your opponent.

-When you say the "old speeder" you mean the one where the riders' legs hung off the speeder.

-You bought Space Hulk, when it was new, in the store.

-You are convinced that was the best GW game ever made.

-You remember fondly your farseer ally for your Space Wolf army.

-When you started you had a curfew imposed by your parents. Now you have a curfew imposed by your children.

-Your own son beats your brains in with his new 18 asscannon+ list.

-Three words: SHOKK ATTACK GUN. Best weapon ever conceived on fluff or action.

-You think back to when Assault Cannons were REALLY tough - 2nd edition when you could fire them 9 times.


I'd add:

-When you started the Dark Angel's Primarch was Lyyn Elgonsen.

-You know that bolters, and tactical dreadnought armour originated in a game called Laserburn.

-You can admit to yourself and others that you need help beating a certain army list, and just don't degrade into calling it beardy or cheese.

Dat Wildboy
04-07-2006, 21:09
it depends what you are a veteran in. i'm a wh40k fluff veteran. i know nearly everything and am proud of it, and similarly for LotR. but i have my grey areas and noobish moments too.

-Own more than one army- yes. i have 3
-Played at least one camp- no
-Played at at least two tournaments- just one
-Played against every single army at least once- no.
-Usually have at least 2 years exp- yes. double that!
-Often know alot about the different armies even though they don't own them- deffinately!
-Often have armies bigger than 2k- no. 1500 is my max.
-Take losing very well and often ponder why- i never stop pondering:confused:
-Great sportsmanship- i'm not sure. wait! i'm english! that means i am!:angel:


let me tell you straight. gaming is not my speciality. converting and painting for the few games i manage is. i love the fluff and love to dive straight into a fictional universe full of conspiracies and war. it makes me feel at home. i am no gaming veteran, but i am helpful and free to sugest whatever. i am a veteran in being a nice guy. and thats a fact!

Dat Wildboy
04-07-2006, 21:12
and i'll add if you remember that leman russ was originally a mere captain. i know of it, but don't remember it, so i can't be that much of a veteran.

Brandir
05-07-2006, 15:43
I think that a veteran is not based on how many tournaments you have entered. It is not based on how many books you have read. It is not about one's age or length of service. To me it is more about maturity. There is absolutely nothing wrong with kids playing games. Nothing wrong with hordes of excited youngsters playing in the same venue, talking to you and hanging on every word of wisdom that you utter.

Sometimes one needs to be in a quieter area with people with a similar outlook and maturity.

But I don't really like the term veteran. It gives the impressin that one reaches the next level in ones GW career when you are over 16, have been playing 2 years and have entered a tournament and not won most sporting opponent because you were the youngest and finished in last place.

The term I would use to describe someone with too much knowledge of armies they don't play with is 'saddo' and is certainly not someone I would look up to ever.

I prefer to leave the term veteran to describe someone who has actually done something useful with their life, such as military sevice; someone who one would look up to and say 'I respect you for what you have done'.

Sorry, but there is absolutely nothing that anyone within 'The Hobby' can do for me to refer to them as a veteran. Afterall, games are just that; games. Who cares if one wins? Who cares is one knows what S5 needs to wound T7 without recourse to the various charts and tables? Who cares if one knows the inside leg measurement of Leman Russ?

Oh yes, I have been playing since age 9 and am now 36. I never read army books for armies I don't use and I am always having to look up the charts to see if I have hit or damaged an opponent.

starlight
06-07-2006, 02:49
In my exhalted:p experience:rolleyes: it think that it has more to do with what you *do* with it.

Vets help others improve.

The Ape
06-07-2006, 12:36
Thank you Brandir - you have summed up what I think of this whole topic with far more clarity than I ever could have.

kortholaxthedamned
28-07-2006, 14:41
i consider myself in the grey area between n00b and Vet. i know every rule for my army and quite a few others, i've learnt the 40k rules to a great extent, but i'm still a noobie when it comes to Fantasy. i've got a necromunda gang, and i've dabbled in Inquisitor, but i don't consider myself a veteran. i'll need to get better at painting first :p

Jedi152
28-07-2006, 14:51
I'd like to call myself a veteran, i have been in this hobby for 14 years, and played almost every game they've done at some point or another, but i genuinely don't think i've got enough experience to be called a vet.

I haven't played 40k since 2nd ed, and i've only got a thin base of 6th WFB games to draw from.

I was thinking of joining the 1st company vets at WW to get more experience, but TBH i'm scared of it being really cliquey.

The Ape
29-07-2006, 13:06
I played against a couple of the guys from 1st Coy at the Epic GT last year, and they were good blokes. If i was you Jedi, i would go down one nite and see what you think.

squiggoth
05-08-2006, 12:34
I will never be a vet. I thought about becoming a vet when I was at high school, but having to stick a syringe into a fluffy little bunny's spine or clipping cat testicles put me off.

The paycheck is good though.

The Ape
05-08-2006, 13:59
I like the cut of your cloth squiggoth