View Full Version : the aeldari god cycle and their rebirth

16-12-2018, 21:17
I've been thinking about the basic metaphysics of gods and souls in 40k and how the potent nature of eldar souls can create gods.

The eldar have had a long association with the concept of reincarnation, both literal and figurative. Currently the phoenix lords and the wraith constructs still represent this concept to a degree.

With the awakening of Ynnead and the existence of Cegorach, Isha and at least bits of Khaine, the eldar pantheon is not completely lost. More than that, the psychic gestalt of belief and the souls concentrated into them across the craftworlds fuels the potential for even more.

There are currently in 40k, reservoirs of powerful souls coalesced around single ideals, ideals and identities rooted in myth from the times before the eldar fall. They keep a kernel of an idea alive and have slowly grown in power over 10,000 years.

They are the Phoenix Lords. Although they are ostensibly representations of Khaine's war aspects, they all cleave close to concepts of his fellow gods. In the case of Baharoth and Jain Zar, they use aspects directly from others - Morai Heg and Faolchu. Asurmen himself is the Hand of Asuryan - a very odd title for a devotee of the jealous god of War.

It could be argued that Khaine's war mantle was won by stealing/copying/bargaining the war aspects of the other gods, hoarding them to himself and thus taking the title of God of War. The war in heaven could certainly have done this.

Staying close the to reincarnation and rebirth aesthetic of the eldar species I see it as entirely possible for their pantheon to be reborn into the modern world, in new aspect and with new purpose.

The Rhana Dandra can be bent to the will of the eldar. The phoenix lords will fight their last fight - and in so doing, ascend into their apotheosis as the new pantheon of the eldar.

Asuryan will be reborn as Asurmen, Morai Heg as Jain Zar, Kurnous as Karandras and Faolchu as Baharroth.

The fires of Fuegan will melt the shards of Khaine and give birth to a new god of war, one tempered by the love of the eldar people rather than contempt.

Maugan Ra will take on the mantle of death, sacrificing Altansar's population to force Ynnead into his form and awaken the power of the dead completely.

The Blackstone Fortresses, Talismen of Vaul. These contain his seed. At the Rana Dandra, the craftworlds will coalesce around this seed and awaken the crippled god from his slumber, whole again.

From each god an avatar can be summoned, represented as the daemonic incarnation of a phoenix Lord of old. The aspects of the gods will form the spirit warriors of their host.

And the eldar will be reborn ascendant once more.

Just for fun and just because I think the correlations are neat. And because having a pantheon of avatars to summon would be cool - especially if they were daemonic phoenix lord designs.

17-12-2018, 04:11
Is a nice theory in general but it lack some stuff

What would happen to Isha?, also Cegorach now have a hand, saying eh plan to slaanesh to free the eldar instead of devoring it, so whil your idea sound posible to a degree, it need some polishing.

17-12-2018, 06:43
Is a nice theory in general but it lack some stuff

What would happen to Isha?, also Cegorach now have a hand, saying eh plan to slaanesh to free the eldar instead of devoring it, so whil your idea sound posible to a degree, it need some polishing.Thanks for your thoughts.

Isha and cegorach are 'complete' gods. They aren't broken, dead or partly awakened.

When the pantheon is reborn, they would be able rejoin them.

Ynnead is supposed to be strong enough to take on slannesh when he's properly awake, so I imagine that a new pantheon would be more than a match.

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17-12-2018, 18:29
Is a good theory in general, the only issue is....would Kahandras or the dark eldar incubi become a god of is own?.

If this idea is canon(I doubt it but is pretty damn god I have to said it), Cegorach have a last jest were he is going to trick slaanesh into saving the eldar rather than dooming them, who is that posible? who knows, also I have this idea that the harlequins are in fact a "warrior aspect" of Cegorach so to speak, since they have the same funtion.

Also the Phoenix lords are aspect of Asuryan in general mix with Khaine, that is why they can return to life and comand respect and awe.

17-12-2018, 22:30
There are many ways this could play out.

With regards to Karandras and Arha, Arha no longer has the psyche of the eldar behind him. He is not conceptualised as the phoenix lord of the striking scorpions so no energy would channel through him during the Rhana Dandra.

At most he might steal some of the murderous aspects of Khaine and become a dark god of murder rather than one of war (the way Khaine is depicted in Warhammer Fantasy).

Cegorach's last laugh - there are lots of ways you could play with this:

1 He comes out of hiding during the Rhana Dandra with his harlequins and fights alongside the Phoenix Lords.

2 He disguises himself as tzeentch, offers aid to Slannesh during the fight and tricks him into pouring his power into a warp vortex to annihilate his foes - only to discover it was the Black Library and the whole thing is set like a giant purifying separator, removing damned eldar souls and cleansing them. They then shunt off to the webway where they join the eternal matrix and fuel the Phoenix Lords' apotheosis. Slannesh's psychic hold over the eldar race is forever broken and his power is weakened tremendously.

3 The entire population of harlequin solitaires possesses a fragment of Cegorach and as they are consumed by slannesh they coalesce inside her, forming a festering thorn. During the Rhana Dandra, the last of the solitaires falls in battle with Slannesh and Cegorach's last laugh is to form INSIDE slannesh like a harlequin's kiss, perforating her form and letting the eldar souls leak out.

The Emancipation of Isha

Isha is imprisoned by Nurgle. It would be more interesting if she were able to break her own bonds rather than be rescued like a damsel.

The first thing that comes to mind for me is trickery. At the Rhana Dandra when her children are being consumed by Slannesh, she begs Nurgle to save them. She offers herself willingly if Nurgle will aid her children.

After 10,000 years of resistance, Nurgle is more than willing to accede to her request and launches a strike on Slannesh. Isha convinces Nurgle to bring her with him so that she may see her children one last time as they are saved.

Unbeknownst to Nurgle, Isha, Cegorach and the mask of the frozen stars has set in motion the Weeping Storm and as the maiden worlds are consumed by the destructive forces of chaos, Isha's strength grows. She overpowers Nurgle, bursting verdant greenery from Nurgles rotting hide. Decay is merely a part of the cycle of life and allows for the emergence of new growth.

Her shackles broken, she sweeps down on the foes of her children with a wrath that gives Khaine pause. 10,000 years of sorrow turns to righteous fury and chaos burns away from her lfe touch.

the upshot of all this is:

Slannesh is no longer she who thirsts, as the link to the eldar is now forever severed. Slannesh will have to beg for souls from all races equally like the other chaos gods.

The eldar are destroyed and reborn. They lose much but gain more. Their racial identity has been restored and their future full of possibilities.

The post Rhana Dandra universe is different but similar to the current one. Perhaps there is less outright xenocide, but the destruction of chaos after the Rhana Dandra makes it a golden age of civilisations. Chaos is on the retreat and while still a threat, not the cicadrix level galactic destroyer it currently is.

20-12-2018, 04:11
Well Asuryan is said to be inside the stomach of Slaanesh. He could not be killed...only held captive. We know of Khaine, Isha, the Laughing god. If Vaul was chained to his anvil.....could he actually be separated from it? Perhaps he is still around and trapped someplace deep within the eye of terror. The hunter and other gods seem very minor and were consumed as the story goes? Now we have Ynead on the stage.

If Asuryan breaks out of Slaanesh....that would pretty much break Slaanesh into pieces much like Khaine was. I can see the elder gods returning some day to 40K to help keep Chaos at bay.

12-01-2019, 19:50
Well Asuryan give the eldar to empower their psyque tendfold so that is why we have farseer.

Is safe to said Asuryan is the aspect of leadership on the eldars: kings, emperor, princes of the eldar all represent Asuryan, and that it show with the phoenix king.