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Easy E
28-07-2006, 00:05
At my used Bookstore I happened across a copy of CAV and the Cav ID manual. I have seen the models online and for sale at my FLGS and I liked what I saw. The Dictator model is sweet.

However, can I get some feedback on this game. Do many people play it. I'd hate to purchase yet another system that no one plays. I just don't have the resources for that.

Plus, how does it differ from other Mecha combat games such as Battletech, Heavy Gear, etc.

Thanks.

erion
28-07-2006, 01:07
As with most other Mecha Games there is a small but fanatical Group of People who play and support this game religiously.

I hate to tell you that the books you saw/purchased(?) will very soon be out of date as far as the rules are concerned. As of now they're expecting to start pre-orders of a new rulebook for the game on August 1st. Which really gets you in on the ground floor. I've been involved in the playtesting of the new system for more than a year and it's really a package of great changes.

Vs. Battletech
Battletech is designed to play very small unit games in a couple of hours. Four Battlemechs (a lance) or five Battlemechs (a Star) per side. Btech is extremely detailed (checking off armor boxes anyone?) and the ranges are universally short. 'Mechs rule the battlefield and almost nothing else (tanks, infantry or aircraft) can touch them.

CAV, on the other hand, is designed around company-level forces with a unit of four CAVs being only one of several platoons that activate and act at the same time during the game.

Most games are played in the 2000-4000 points range, and that will allow you to field two platoons of armor (CAV's, tanks, or a combination of Both), some infantry in the footslogging or mechanized varieties, and various support units like gunships and close fire support platoons. And the game will not last more than 2-3 hours. Ranges are realistic. Indirect Fire can reach (rather inaccurately) across the long edge of a 4'x6' table. Oh yeah, and the points costs for units are balanced. 500 points of infantry is just as likely to come away victorious as 500 points of CAV if they're played properly.

Vs. Heavy Gear
I haven't played Heavy Gear in a Very long time, but I do know that the damage system is still much more detailed and picky than CAV. In CAV, you don't keep track of armor points or rounds fired, but simply how much damage your model has taken (called a Damage Track (TM) ). As you take damage your models' capabilities are decreased (like less mobility, less accurate weapons, etc) until it is destroyed. And each model is capable of self-repair to some degree, which means that unless it's completely eliminated, any model is still something of a threat. Not like BT where 12 points of damage to the head elminated any model in the game.

Feel free to ask questions as you have them. I'm an officially licensed representative of Reaper and here to help.

Also, you can check out cavhq.reapergames.com for free downloads of the CAV2 Beta Test documents to read over so you really know what you're getting into. There have been some changes to the way things are, but those will get you in the right direction. You'll need to register a username to find them (it's free). They'll be under the "featured downloads" link on the left menu bar.

jazzdude78
28-07-2006, 04:41
The biggest thing that hurt CAV imho was its taking forever for the 2nd edition to come out

not that I have anything against the first (in fact I rather liked it) but waiting for the upgrade does tend to kill player interest (though slow updates seem common among mecha games for some reason)

erion
28-07-2006, 09:01
You'll get no argument from me that the long road to CAV2 has been bumpy. They first announced the 2nd edition (as opposed to a revised first edition we had been originally told to expect) in June 2004. So It's been more than two years in the making now, but we are on the home stretch.

I've been involved in the playtesting since November of '04, and I can tell you that, at least in the last version of the rules I have seen, every single one of my concerns about the playability of the game has been addressed to my satisfaction.

And I was just ranting about how the gaming gods hate mecha games, because of the huge delay for Heavy Gear 3rd edition, CAV2's long road, and now Fanpro has announced a delay to the release for Battletech: Total Warafre again.

erion
29-07-2006, 10:23
News out of Reaper Yesterday is that CAV2 is going to be delayed, possibly until after GenCon (August 10-13).

Just popping in to keep all the info on the up-and-up...

Senbei
01-08-2006, 08:42
The two things that always stopped me from playing CAV were, a: the blocky similar looking Mechs (I could live with that bit, they're not too bad) and, more importantly, b: the way that many of the CAV players I met/talked to on forums had the view that the -other big mech game- was a big, evil thing that needed to be squashed. Even the Reaper main forums has a 'Why CAV is better than Xxxxxxxxxx' Thread.... I don't even truly support GW game bashing so I looked no further when I saw them attacking my favorite game..... )_)

erion
01-08-2006, 10:48
Every Game has it's fanatics. One of those CAV vs. BT threads pops up every now and then, and I've stopped participating in them because they rehash the same old stuff, and when a voice of reason tries to step in and say why CAV is not necessarily better, just different, you can actually hear the gnashing of teeth through the internet. Remember that the thread you mention is on the company-run forums. Of course they're going to be pumping up CAV and putting down other mecha games.

I do prefer CAV, but that's primarily because I like to have lots of models on the table when I play. There are, however, a number of Clan Jade Falcon mechs on my desk as I write this.

Easy E
02-08-2006, 03:26
I have browsed the 1st edition rules found for free at freewargamesrules.uk (or something like that) and found them fairly streamlined and easy to understand. However, they really only talked about CAV units if I remeber correctly. Can you tell me a bit about how the flyers work?

erion
02-08-2006, 11:40
Flyers really work the same way. They have faster movement rates and are more fragile, but the basic mechanics are the same. The only real difference is in the Movement Types, and the terrain modifiers that apply to them. For example, the only movement modifiers that really apply to aircraft is for the requirement to change elevations, whereas a model with movement type "walker" (for CAVs) will get modifiers for moving through rough terrain, swamp, woods, etc., as well as elevation changes. Also, flyers never block line of sight to models behind them.

Of course, all that's based on the last version of the beta test rules. No telling what may have changed, but from CAV1 to CAV2 Beta 1.5 the only real difference in movement was that models no longer had to pay movement points to change facings, which really sped things up.

Which really is to say, there aren't a whole bunch of special rules that apply to different classes of models in the game. The basic rules for all unit types are the same, with some special abilities defined on each datacard that help to make them different.

erion
26-08-2006, 12:09
Reaper has officially announced a release date for three new models.

While not "new" in the strictest sense (we've been using all three of these in the game since the rules were first published), they are now true-to-scale as opposed to the 1/3 scale ones initially released. Look for them in stores on September 4th.

Mitso-ta Tsuiseki (Terran Faction)
http://www.reapermini.com/albums/cav/7099_G.jpg

Mitso-ta Kikyu (Terran Faction)
http://www.reapermini.com/albums/cav/7100_G.jpg

Mark IV Hedgehog (Malvernian Faction)
http://www.reapermini.com/albums/cav/7101_G.jpg

It had been previously announced that these three models would be released at the same time as the Rules PDF/Book pre-order, so speculation is rampant that we'll see the rules hit Reaper's online store that day as well. Of course, no one from Reaper is confirming or denying that so far.

beardstache
31-08-2006, 23:11
While were still on the subject of the models, what is the scale of CAV, 10mm or 6mm?

nanite
01-09-2006, 01:26
CAV is US N-Scale about 1/160.

Most of the existing tanks and aircraft are in a smaller scale, hence the new 'up-sized' models in 1/160.

CyberShadow
01-09-2006, 11:58
To add to nanites reply... the minis work out at about 11mm, so 10mm works fine for them.

(CS, waiting impatiently for CAV2 rules to become available!)

erion
01-09-2006, 13:21
Lots of us are Cybershadow. :)

Word out to Black Lightning Demo guys last night was Mid-Late September for the PDF to be finalized and posted. Given the other Delays associated with the rules, even I am not finding that to be an unreasonable delay.

CyberShadow
01-09-2006, 14:15
So, not the beginning of September then? :cries: I was looking for Sept 4th! I guess that another couple of weeks wont make much difference.

erion
01-09-2006, 14:57
I was originally hoping for a 9/4 release as well. This latest delay is to get the finished product into the hands of some people who haven't been looking at it every day since May and make sure everything clicks.

Seeing as how the public beta test rules haven't been updated since this time last year, getting the game out of the studio and into the hands of some people who will actually be playing it without detailed knowledge of the development process can only be a good thing.

erion
01-09-2006, 21:46
Another new pair of models.

Syram Dingo (Terran Faction)
http://www.reapermini.com/albums/cav/7102_G.jpg

KDM Fenri (Ritterlich Faction)
http://www.reapermini.com/albums/cav/7103_G.jpg

These are going to be released in September as well, probably closer to the end of the month.

You can always check out all the models for CAV here (http://www.reapermini.com/gallery/cav?page=1).

Senbei
03-09-2006, 19:03
*sigh* Such cool vehicles.... I want some... Shame about the boring Mech's :/

Still.... Heavy Tank with AMS and a large-bore RAC... That sounds like fun...

erion
03-09-2006, 19:07
Well, it's entirely possible to play cav with a force that contains aboslutely no mecha and still win games. Heck, the Ritterlich faction has always had a history of being slow to adopt the CAV into it's mostly tank army.

In CAV2, the Primary Armor Platoon allows you to field CAV's, tanks, or a mixture as both, as well as Mechanized or Footslogging infantry as your core force units. If you want to play without any mecha at all, go for it.

Which of the CAV's do you find so unappealing, just out of curiosity?

Senbei
03-09-2006, 19:38
Heh, most of them.. Then again the sheer variation of B-Tech Mech forces is probably to blame... Shame that vehicles and infantry are a bit pants and 'samey' in their game...