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Rob
08-12-2006, 10:19
When I played the old "Space Marines" epic game back in the early 90's it was actually a very cool game.

I played Squats and Tyranids (with the old hex tiles for synapse creatures) while my friend played either orks or space marines.

Is this game dead?

I have boxes of epic pieces like squat gyrocopters/land trains/dominatrix'/mega gargants/ and imperator titan etc.. Even an unused box of squat troops still on thier sprues! All collecting dust in my garage.

Is this game still featured in White Dwarf?

This is what happens when you clean your house. You should see some of the old 40k stuff I have! I have a bunch of Harlequin jetbikes? Can you use them?

Sorry for ranting. Looking at all this stuff brings me back to my single unmarried with no children days.:(

Acolyte of Bli'l'ab
08-12-2006, 10:22
it might as well be dead for the little support Specialist Games gives it, if you want new models that is. (allthough I dont blame them as its only ONE person running it now!!)

t-tauri
08-12-2006, 10:24
It's not dead. There's still an enthusiastic fanbase out there. Support is entirely internet based now. I've moved this to Specialist games where you may get a few more replies.
I have boxes of epic pieces like squat gyrocopters/land trains/dominatrix'/mega gargants/ and imperator titan etc.. Even an unused box of squat troops still on thier sprues! All collecting dust in my garage.
Whack it on ebay if you're thinking of giving up. Because there's very little new stuff the old things demand premium prices on ebay. With good photos and a bit of luck you could go a long way towards paying for some Christmas presents for the kids. The Imperator titan goes for around 30 on it's own in decent condition.

Bombot
08-12-2006, 10:28
Well I play Epic:Armageddon. Great game, if rather lacking in support. But the game itself is not in dire need of fixing; it just needs minis for more races.

Kriegsherr
08-12-2006, 10:42
They did spanking good new space marine vehicle minis for Epic:Armaggeddon.

If the Infantry would have been renewed (anyone knows what has become of the multiposed epic marines from FW that rumours once told us about? And even a picture has been on the internet of?), and similar standarts would have been applied to the new ork minis, I would again have started buying epic stuff.

As is, even though I and all my pals own quite large epic armies (I alone have a Gargant big mob featuring 2 great gargants and around six or seven normal gargants), my pals just weren't interested in epic:armaggeddon so I only played it when the testrules were available once or twice.

It was great though. Really a pity GW doesn't supports it. Epic and Warmaster would make more sense as third core game than LotR.

The Ape
08-12-2006, 10:52
The multi-part epic space marine model from Forge World was a Games Day 2003 (I think) exclusive model. It was never intended for general release.

It was being sold for about £3 I think - I never managed to get one as I was working on the Helms Deep stand that day.

orangesm
08-12-2006, 12:50
I would call Epic (and probably Warmaster) the open-sourced games of GW. The player base is also the group that makes new armylist. Some search the net for various proxies for minis GW is not producing.

I have seen full Necron Armies (with original minis) online, a range that has no minis from GW - ever.

Alot of the range as you know has existed at one time or another. The minis go back and forth online. There are rumors of Chaos Infantry sprue coming in early 2007 (probably later).

So it is out there. Just need to conjure up interest in the game and try and get GW to support it a little more - hard to do when I have to search for minis.

Check out Tactical Command (http://www.tacticalwargames.net/cgi-bin/forum/ikonboard.cgi?) for the current Epic development.

Wow at least 11 unique replies on here as well.

Kriegsherr
08-12-2006, 13:53
The multi-part epic space marine model from Forge World was a Games Day 2003 (I think) exclusive model. It was never intended for general release.

It was being sold for about 3 I think - I never managed to get one as I was working on the Helms Deep stand that day.

Sure? Man, why do this? I would buy loads of them, even at 3 pounds for one marine. It looked really sweet.

I think there are more insaniacs like me out there that would kill for decent epic infantry minis.

firestorm40k
08-12-2006, 14:02
When I played the old "Space Marines" epic game back in the early 90's it was actually a very cool game.

I played Squats and Tyranids (with the old hex tiles for synapse creatures) while my friend played either orks or space marines.

Is this game dead?


In that incarnation, I'm afraid it is :( At least officially, anyway; there has been a great deal of support on the internet to keep it going, which I will come to later.

It was super-ceded in 1997 when GW released a new version called 'Epic 40,000', but this died out after a couple of years.

Epic was revived in 2004 with the release of Epic Armageddon - you can download this set of rules for free in the Epic section of the Specialist Games (www.specialist-games.com) website.

Finally, if it's a game like the Space Marine you used to play back in the early '90's, you need NetEpic (or NetEpic Gold, as it's current version is called).

This is available FREE! for download from the NetEpic website (netepic.org), in the downloads section. As stated above, this has been a 'fan' project kept alive by various internet communities. It is based upon the Space Marine rules set, but expands them with new races and rules for Epic minis produced by Forge World and other 6mm miniature producers.

So basically, Epic is alive in some form or-other, you can still buy Epic scale minis from GW, and there is still a passionate and sizable base of support for it.

I hope this helps! :cool:

Honda
08-12-2006, 17:08
Epic Armageddon is doing quite well. Does it have full support of GW, not from a resource perspective, but the game has become what it is because of the player base.

Get involved, start small and you'll be surprised at how many other "closet" Epic players you will run into. The Specialist Games are among some of the best designed games systems ever.

Hena
08-12-2006, 17:12
As many have said the current version of epic is in fact called 'Epic: Armageddon'. It's not dead, but not much pushed and in a same place as the rest of the Specialist Games (http://www.specialist-games.com) range.

And as others have already said, the actual development has moved to the shoulders of players. You can see the latest rules review for the game in specialist games forum (http://www.specialist-games.com/forum). For lot of discussion and some official (as well as unofficial) army development can be found in the above mentioned tactical wargames site. For example the Tyranids are developed there.

And I'm trying to do a resurrection and conversion of old and new players where I live so I ain't giving up this game. I suggest you go grab a copy of the rules from specialist site as this version is a lot better than that SM2 era game (which hooked me in the system).

Grimshawl
08-12-2006, 19:33
As others have said Epic is a great Game, the latest edition Epic Armageddon is really good rules wise and unfortunately really poor support wise. As long as you and whoever you get to play it with you look for absolutely no support from GW and instead look to the other hardcore fans to keep the game going you should be okay.
If you just want to play oldschool go with NetEpic, these guys have been keeping it alive and doing it proud.

Chaos and Evil
11-12-2006, 13:05
I have 30+ multi-part Marines.

They're cool. :D

nealhunt
12-12-2006, 12:39
Perhaps more specific to the OP's questions...

For Epic: Armageddon, there are currently lists for 5 of the core races - SM, IG, Ork, Eldar, and Chaos - as well as multiple variants, either official or in development (SM chapters, Speed Freeks, etc.). Notably missing are Tyranids, Necrons and Tau. And, obviously, Squats are out of the 40K-verse.

Development lists are in process, mostly on Tactical Command but also on the SG boards. Jaldon is the army champion (lead fan developer) for the Tyranids. Corey3570 is champion for Necrons. Cybershadow is champion for Tau. There is a list of offical army champions for various armies on the SG boards if you want to provide input. It's sticky in the Experimental Rules section.

Nids are pretty close to being done. The army strcture and special rules are set. It's down to tweaking around with the stats for the big bugs and a few point costs. If you want to test them, I know Jaldon would love to hear your feedback. The minis are available at a reasonable price if you have patience but tend to eBay for ridiculous amounts.

Several fan lists exist for Squats. Jaldon (the Nid champion) also did a set of lists for them that had variations based on differing homeworld guild compositions. I haven't played them but they looked pretty good to me. I haven't reviewed any of the other Squat fanlists.

pookie
12-12-2006, 13:04
anyone got a pic of the multi part marine?

Chaos and Evil
12-12-2006, 17:21
Here's some of mine:

http://elf.planetquake.gamespy.com/pics/epic/tactical.jpg

orangesm
12-12-2006, 19:26
The background there is great by the way.

lee
12-12-2006, 19:41
it might as well be gw just dont promote it any more:cries:

orangesm
12-12-2006, 19:57
lee did you read any of the other post?

ex-green
14-12-2006, 14:38
Its not dead just hard to find other players. The support from GW is sporadic at best but there are some good sites out there keeping the torch burning. Just look on auction sites for oop models and GW have good range for core races.

Acolyte of Bli'l'ab
14-12-2006, 15:11
@Chaos and Evil,

those marines look ***** amazing!

----

Also, I really wish their were official necron models, I dont have the time for converting, chaos androids are too expensive and dark realm mini's andrayadas dont look necrony enough for me (they are good though). I'd personally be happy if every army had official minis...

Bombot
14-12-2006, 16:51
Yeah, those Marines do look pretty snazzy. Now I want some!

Epic traffic on various forums seems to have picked up lately. Not sure why (but I won't complain!).

nealhunt
14-12-2006, 18:47
:chrome: We're everywhere...
:chrome: You will be assimilated...

Bombot
14-12-2006, 19:18
I am not a number...

But no, I was specifically thinking of traffic from Epic 'non-regulars' (at the risk of sounding cliquey).

Milo
15-12-2006, 19:08
I am not a number...

But no, I was specifically thinking of traffic from Epic 'non-regulars' (at the risk of sounding cliquey).

Check your pm's

Parka boy
15-12-2006, 22:46
I played it when it first came out and thought it was a super game. I thought about getting back into it but couldn't find anyone else or enough figures to encourage me to do so. Plus it hurts to remember how much of the stuff I dumped.

It annoys me no end that GW has left this great game a the back of the cupboard to push the stinka that is LOTR, not a bad system for a small games of cowboys but is dire at anything more than skirmishers.

Mr_Rose
15-12-2006, 23:20
Totally agree here; Epic: Armageddon may be the greatest game GW ever devised, and is certainly up there with WFB and Talisman...

LOTR on the other hand, is a fantastic skirmish system and unbelievably cinematic, but it was totally wasted on the LOTR property, which really stinks, 'cause I understand that GW can't now use it for anything else...

orangesm
15-12-2006, 23:31
I think they managed to get the system out originally with the Western Cowboy game - I heard it was good fun, never played though.

At this point GW is trying to make as much as possibly off of LOTR until it would be time for another Edition (6-7 year cycle). At that point what happens? Do they recycle the material? Or go back to supporting Epic, Gothic, Necromunda, Warmaster, Mordheim, maybe even bring back Man-o-War...

Acolyte of Bli'l'ab
16-12-2006, 01:46
Totally agree here; Epic: Armageddon may be the greatest game GW ever devised.

Agreed. Best game EVARRR. If only it had official models for all the races though.

Rob
17-12-2006, 08:10
Nids are pretty close to being done. The army strcture and special rules are set. It's down to tweaking around with the stats for the big bugs and a few point costs. If you want to test them, I know Jaldon would love to hear your feedback. The minis are available at a reasonable price if you have patience but tend to eBay for ridiculous amounts.

Several fan lists exist for Squats. Jaldon (the Nid champion) also did a set of lists for them that had variations based on differing homeworld guild compositions. I haven't played them but they looked pretty good to me. I haven't reviewed any of the other Squat fanlists.

I have a whole mess of Tyranid stuff except for probably the Heirophant, Heirodule, and Harridan. I have the usual Dominatrix', Trygons, Carnifex', Hive Tyrants, etc. I'll have to look and see. It's been a while. It would be nice to use this stuff again.

As for the Squats I have a few pieces that I don't even remember the names for. Cyclops maybe? Leviathan might be another.

I'll have to go back to the REALLY old White Dwarf mags I have and have a look see at all the old Space Marine models.

Chaos and Evil
17-12-2006, 09:42
It would be nice to use this stuff again.

Where do you live?

Rob
17-12-2006, 09:49
Where do you live?

USA, New York

sigur
17-12-2006, 10:11
....
As for the Squats I have a few pieces that I don't even remember the names for. Cyclops maybe? Leviathan might be another.
...

Yup, you can find these things as well as landtrains, gyrocopters, these huge artillery guns, etc. On ebay regularly and they are sold at quite high prices. Personally, I've never played Epic myself as there is no interest in this game here (funnily enough, people in my area are more interested in Warmaster and of course BFG), but I got the plastic Squats about a year ago, just because I like those little guys.;)

Tastyfish
19-12-2006, 11:34
I think we'll probably see a resurgence after the Death corps and Chaos forces have been released as new minis are now Forgeworld's domain from what I've heard.

Dwarf Supreme
19-12-2006, 16:33
USA, New York

Too bad you aren't closer to me. I live in CT, near Hartford. I know of a couple of players in northern Jersey.

Acolyte of Bli'l'ab
16-01-2007, 18:18
I think we'll probably see a resurgence after the Death corps and Chaos forces have been released as new minis are now Forgeworld's domain from what I've heard.

If they do Epic scale necrons and DE id be very happy, but I cant say I have much hope for this.

nealhunt
17-01-2007, 13:03
There probably won't be Dark Eldar minis. FW doesn't do any 40K scale stuff for them and they have been officially pronounced by Jervis as not intended to ever be an official Epic army.

Necrons have never had an official release from GW and are (nominally) supposed to be developed, so that could theoretically happen. However, the latest rumored business plan from FW is to produce Epic scale models only of their 40K lines. That may or may not hold, but any chance of them producing a full Necron army like the Tau is currently slim and far in the future.

Acolyte of Bli'l'ab
17-01-2007, 16:27
I expected as much, but even so im dissapointed.

Pulsar
17-01-2007, 17:43
The only way i can see Epic getting the support i needs, like new models and rules, is FW were to take over development of it, they are the only people in the GW empire that can do games on a small scale(no pun intened) , things like Epic, and thanks to GW Epic is a small game with a small fan base, like all other SG.

And i think we, as Epic gamers are the only people who can make GW keep Epic alve, how to make GW do this i don't know

Pulsar
17-01-2007, 17:46
and but the way nice pic E & C.

Hena
17-01-2007, 18:05
The only way i can see Epic getting the support i needs, like new models and rules, is FW were to take over development of it, they are the only people in the GW empire that can do games on a small scale(no pun intened) , things like Epic, and thanks to GW Epic is a small game with a small fan base, like all other SG.

This is the bit that I don't understand. Currently the Epic is set up so that FW doesn't need to rules. All they need to have is someone making sure that armies and what-not are in line of GW fluff. Armies, rules and so on are then created, modifed and updated by the players. All they need to do is make the minis ...

Acolyte of Bli'l'ab
17-01-2007, 19:13
all I want is official miniatures for my favourite army in my favourite game, as I do NOT like the alternative options like paper counter/andrayasa or ebaying chaos androids. Shame thats too much to ask, as I think FW would do a great job and id be willing to spend in the 1000s.

orangesm
17-01-2007, 21:24
Well buy other things from FW and tell them what you want.

Tastyfish
17-01-2007, 22:43
Or just email them and ask for epic necrons

Acolyte of Bli'l'ab
17-01-2007, 23:18
As far as iv seen, they do not have an email address to contact them about such matters on their website.

Chaos and Evil
17-01-2007, 23:41
FW are (Quite justifiably) nervous of investing in having more Epic product lines that they don't control the rules for (Like AI), perhaps as they've been somewhat mistreated by SG in the past (Almost all their models lack rules & points, because SG wanted to sell their own models over FW's seemingly).

Acolyte of Bli'l'ab
17-01-2007, 23:54
Yeah, that kind of sucks. I definitly dont blame FW though. I would ideally like if they took over many of the SG lines like ; Epic, Inquisitor, necromunda and BSG.

A death-robot can dream.

firestorm40k
18-01-2007, 07:37
Well, a FW Necron or other Epic army WOULD be supported by rules, and not given rough-shod treatment by SG; because WE, the gamers, are the ones making the rules for Necrons (and DE, etc).

Such a line WOULD be supported by proper rules, which will have been subject to thorough ongoing playtesting and adjustment, because WE are the ones doing it.

I guess the only way that FW would get round to doing Necrons is for all of us Epic players to get on their backs and hassle them enough :evilgrin:

I'm up for it, anyone else? :D

Chaos and Evil
18-01-2007, 13:43
Hassling FW to make Epic figures is the best thing you can do, oddly enough. :D

Acolyte of Bli'l'ab
18-01-2007, 14:02
so what is there email addy then ? iv looked at could not find one, perhaps im jsut too stupid.

Chaos and Evil
18-01-2007, 14:05
Surprisingly: forgeworld@games-workshop.co.uk

Acolyte of Bli'l'ab
18-01-2007, 14:17
Done, but I simply got this auto-reply :

If you have a question about your mail order, a problem you need resolved, or anything else urgent, please telephone us for an immediate resolution as we are currently unable to answer emails.

Calling from the United Kingdom Tel: 0115 9168177.
Calling from outside the UK dial your international operator then Tel: ++44 115 9168177. For example: calling from the USA dial 011 44 115 9168177

Our office opening times are between 9:00am - 6:00pm UK time Monday to Friday.

When making a query about an order please have as much information available as possible, (e.g. name and address of person who placed the order, name and address of person to whom we were sending the order, when the order was placed, how the order was placed etc.)

Finally, I would like to offer my apologies that we are not able to answer your email. I trust that my colleagues and I will be able to talk to you on the phone and help sort out your query.
Thx,

Ewen Little,
Forge World Sales Manager.

firestorm40k
18-01-2007, 14:46
They'll look in to it, a couple of years ago I e-mailed them to enquire whether they'd any plans for a new version of the Imperator Titan, and they did respond.

So we can be optimistic that they will this time... :)

Acolyte of Bli'l'ab
18-01-2007, 15:22
Thanks, what did they say about a new version of an imperator out of interest ?

gruubii
18-01-2007, 16:06
:eek: salivates at Robs leftovers in his house... Ok, had to recover there, yeah, there is epic Armageddon, and Swordwind books, which are Epic, but as far as I know there is no coverage except perhaps the occasional fling from Specialst Games. old eldar jetbikes..mmm

Dwarf Supreme
18-01-2007, 16:29
Well, a FW Necron or other Epic army WOULD be supported by rules, and not given rough-shod treatment by SG; because WE, the gamers, are the ones making the rules for Necrons (and DE, etc).

Such a line WOULD be supported by proper rules, which will have been subject to thorough ongoing playtesting and adjustment, because WE are the ones doing it.



Amen, brother. I think FW could make a killing if they released Necrons.

Brother Othorio
18-01-2007, 16:50
FW are (Quite justifiably) nervous of investing in having more Epic product lines that they don't control the rules for (Like AI), perhaps as they've been somewhat mistreated by SG in the past (Almost all their models lack rules & points, because SG wanted to sell their own models over FW's seemingly).

i think its definately the former, if anything its FW that has mistreated SG:
all the relevant FW EPIC minis were statted out in the collectors models section of the EPIC:Armageddon rulebook

SG released an aledgedly well balance and playable Tau list for using the FW Tau ships in Battlefleet Gothic (apparently the Taros Campaign book just includes ships stats, not an actual army list, and aledgedly the ships arent very well statted either) ~ FW immediately threw a hissy-fit and demanded the list be pulled

SG kept asking FW if they were going to do an EPIC Hellblade fighter so that they could work out and playtest stats for it for the Black Legion army list but FW refused to give them an answer until two weeks before the Black Legion list was to be finalised (thereby not giving them time to playtest it ~ infact it may even have been a public anouncement, they might not even have bothered to tell SG beforehand)

nealhunt
18-01-2007, 17:50
The only way i can see Epic getting the support i needs, like new models and rules, is FW were to take over development of it, they are the only people in the GW empire that can do games on a small scale(no pun intened) , things like Epic, and thanks to GW Epic is a small game with a small fan base, like all other SG.

I'd take over as Producer for Epic development on a freelance basis in a heartbeat if that were an option. :D

Seriously, I think 6 months of concerted effort could turn out 2 new entirely races (Tau and Necron) and 8-10 total lists counting variants like SM chapters, craftworlds, etc..

Chaos and Evil
18-01-2007, 20:23
all the relevant FW EPIC minis were statted out in the collectors models section of the EPIC:Armageddon rulebook

Half of those stats are slap-dash ones that don't actually suit the pieces in question, and none of them have points costs. Effectively they're discouraged.


When you get down to it there's been wrongings by both departments.



I'd take over as Producer for Epic development on a freelance basis in a heartbeat if that were an option.

*Raises hand as Assistant Freelance Producer!* :D

Hena
18-01-2007, 20:24
I'd add the Tyranids into that list as well. Most of the stuff for the lists is done. WEs and some AVs still require work to be done, but the idea of them and stats to some degree are already done.

Btw, Anyone know Jaldon in RL (or can contact him) as he's not been around for a while in TacCom?

Acolyte of Bli'l'ab
18-01-2007, 21:41
I actually heard a rumour FW did some Tyranid stuff (not infantry), anyone clarify it ?

Pulsar
18-01-2007, 22:01
I'd take over as Producer for Epic development on a freelance basis in a heartbeat if that were an option. :D

Seriously, I think 6 months of concerted effort could turn out 2 new entirely races (Tau and Necron) and 8-10 total lists counting variants like SM chapters, craftworlds, etc..

Please, Please, Please, Please, Please, Please, Please, Please,
if in any way WE as Epic Fans could make this happen you will have as much intrest than you can handle.:D

Hena
19-01-2007, 02:46
I actually heard a rumour FW did some Tyranid stuff (not infantry), anyone clarify it ?
Forge has sold Harridans, but not anymore. Also there is a picture of Hierophant.

http://www.tacticalwargames.net/cgi-bin/forum/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=21;t=5250

Also there has been a partially made hierodule, but I can't seem to find a thread where it was. E&C should have it somewhere though, so maybe he will post as well :).

Chaos and Evil
19-01-2007, 10:36
http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/epic/hierodule1.jpg
http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/epic/hierodule.jpg


Not yet released.

Hena
19-01-2007, 12:07
Hmm ... thats a Leman Russ variant behind it, right? If so then it's rather ... small.

Chaos and Evil
19-01-2007, 14:08
It's the same scale to the Russ as it is in 40k.

Heirodules are only the size of a Land Raider, give or take a bit.

Acolyte of Bli'l'ab
19-01-2007, 15:48
thanks for the links, those look pretty damn nice... almost enough to make me want to start epic tyranids.