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FalseAngel
02-01-2007, 02:46
Hello, what with C:CSM more than likely coming late this year or early next year (people are saying after Orks) I was thinking to myself about the standard chaos marines. To me, something has always just not sat right with the models. I personally love the art usually, but it is FAR different from the models. I'd love to see them redo the standard marines of chaos with the new release as I think they are quite important seeing as they can easily make up 70-90% of your force.

However, I'm not entirely sure what exactly it is they need. The art often has the armor of the marines warped and overly detailed, and we know that won't happen with plastics. Still I think that they are far too similar to the imperial marines and are too clean and new looking. I have a hard time going with the idea that they have Mk. 6-7 armor when they wouldn't have that many post-heresy suits. At least not for the original legions.

At best I can think that they should give them older armor, and a more simplistic, knightly look. What I mean by knightly is like... make the armor less sleek and more heavy and chunky, with pre-heresy visor helmets.

Anyway, the reason I posted this is because I became curious as to what you guys and gals thought would be nice to further seperate CSM from SM outside of just poorly details arrows and spikes. :)

ImBiginKorea
02-01-2007, 02:50
Yeah some new models could be really cool. I would assume they will redo the undivided CSM, and termies, and probably thousand suns models. They might decide to redo the Khorne and Nurgle but those models are pretty new. (in GW update length)

My 2 cents.

--Korea

FalseAngel
02-01-2007, 02:59
Speaking of Khorne, the Beserkers are good models outside of the hands and weapons. I hope they recut the sprue with updated bolt pistols and properly sized/shaped hands.

InquisitorNiels
02-01-2007, 03:51
I want good looking Night Lords! Those helmets are just stupid. I think more skull like masks for them would be much better, or something like a really nasty visage. The wings dont make me think scary, not at all.

As for the basic non legion marines I think the models are just fine, maybe an older style of armour would really set them apart, or seeing as over 10,000 years of fighting they might have to make new armour, so something really diffrent. As for ideas I have no clue, I cant draw nor do I have a never creative mind when it comes to new ideas.

Tanith Ghost
02-01-2007, 04:07
As for helms, i love the 'T' visors on some of the older marines. It reminds me so much of the mandalorians and their 'evil with a purpose' mentality. It beats the hell out of the 'OMG wer EVIL!!!11111!!!!1111'.

LictorIntheGrass
02-01-2007, 04:37
Yeah old style models would be nice. Make hella more sense us having them than Space Marines but we all know they are the GW's favorites. Sigh... Warped armor on a few of the Marines would be cool. While CSM are nuts, does mean they've all have been driving insane. Serious what can you do with an idiot how can't stop gibbering like a nutcase. I'd like to see new bare heads and new helmets the most.

Marshal2Crusaders
02-01-2007, 04:55
bare head definatly, horns aplenty. the armor really needs to be warped so much so you cant file them down and use them in a pace marine army. that wont happen. they will rehash the old sprues, and update all the legion specific models. nurgle upgrades, khrone upgrades, slaneesh upgrades, and tzneetch upgrades. i think in the new codex they will make it so the same 9 legions arnt played over and over, theyll make renegade rules like the traits system.

Mr_Smiley
02-01-2007, 06:03
I quite like the current Chaos models, the only units I hate are the Chosen Terminators.
I really like the defilers and I like the Berserker models as well.

boardbox
02-01-2007, 06:23
Well i'd like to see less of the funny straight up ponytails, never sat right with me. Having a couple of capes could be fun. Other than that, I like the current models. The big thing I would add, battle damage, isn't hard to convert or paint.

T visors sound pretty cool.

New Cult King
02-01-2007, 06:27
As for helms, i love the 'T' visors on some of the older marines. It reminds me so much of the mandalorians and their 'evil with a purpose' mentality. It beats the hell out of the 'OMG wer EVIL!!!11111!!!!1111'.

But we all know that if something doesn't have lotsa spikes on, then it's just not teh EviL!1!!

Serpent
02-01-2007, 07:48
Well, I'd like some of the newest models to be returne to the melting pot and thouroughly recast. Possessed anyone? :wtf: http://uk.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.uk?do=Individual&code=99110102095&orignav=10

Apart from that, I'd also like plastic terminators, better Berzerkers, new Sorcerers, all-plastic Havocs and perhaps a plastic Lord box.

The standard Marines are fine, in my tastes.

Serpent

darren redstar
02-01-2007, 08:28
my only worry with new csm models is that they might be sculpted by who ever created(?) the new possessed

Nabeshin1106
02-01-2007, 08:39
I think the current CSM models are fine, they should should just make God-specific plastic sprues.

And plastic terminators.

Misanthrope
02-01-2007, 09:37
Yes, I've been thinking that, I'd really like to see them make CSM models in general look far more Chaotic and pre-heresy. As it is they look like regular SM armour with a touch of extra detailing like a spike on the knee or arrows on the pads etc etc... also the Predator -- IMO it really sucks that the best they can do for CSM vehicles is simply to use regular SM vehicles and stick a single "Chaos vehicle accessory sprue" in there... I hate that. I know its cutting corners but I'd really like it if they'd actually make Chaos vehicles that aren't, you know, duplicates of Marine vehicles with spikes.

Seriously, though, how pissed do you think WHFB players would be if GW made Chaos warriors look like Empire Militiamen with Chaos stars and zany hair?

Insane Psychopath
02-01-2007, 09:40
I'd like to see Legion spure, much like there doing with Imperial Space Marines.

IW: Bionic legs, arm, Bare head with Bionic Eye, shoulder pads with icon, upper body armour & cool add ones. Some cool helemts like the got right now.

NL: None of this bat wing but possible have there helmets look like skulls (like the Death Korp ST models), have tons of trohpyies.

AL: Have a few there helmet look like lizard/have scale & same gose with Shoulder pads have little add on scales.

These are but a few exsample & of course there would be more added to them. So each legion spure would have somthing cool.

In genral would like to see:
Spikey helmets
Studded shoulder pads like the Marines
Some cool more cool shoulder pads
Running legs
Left handed Bolt Pistol arms & right handed Chainsword arms.
Skull & other trophyies
10 Chaos Marines in a set
Some specil weapon & hopeful heavy weapon in plastic
Plastic Chaos Lord/Lt

If you like that the UK WD 202 that John B drawings of Chaos marine "conversion idea" they are pretty sweet & what I use for idea for both my Iron Warriors & Black Legion.

I find some of the current Chaos Marine plastic kit alright, but then again I alway like to convert my models :D

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v473/ironwarriors/insane%20psycopath/Spiky.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v473/ironwarriors/insane%20psycopath/Narach.jpg

Sir_Turalyon
02-01-2007, 09:49
The current models are good enough, but I would love new kit with power armour older then Mark 7 - well scupulted mark 2,3,4 (crusade, maximus, iron) suits would look characterful and archaic.

Acolyte of Bli'l'ab
02-01-2007, 09:55
I dont like the current range personally, like others here id like to see them look more chaotic and pre-heresy, the current models look too cheesy or "tryhard we are teh evool!11" which puts me off them alot.

Horusaurus
02-01-2007, 10:09
CSM will always be loyalist SM with spikes and trims. Because it's cheaper and easier to do it that way rather than having to sculpt a whole bunch of new stuff.

Darkseer
02-01-2007, 10:14
More plastic stuff is on the way, including plastic chaos terminators.

The UK didn't help invade Iraq for nothing you know ;)

Dreachon
02-01-2007, 10:19
Let's not forget to get a new dreadnought as well, it's starting to age along with the berzerkers, those could really use an updated.
For the basic csm, I don't really see much change and it'll depend on how much room GW will allow for adjustment, they might just only get a recut sprue like the loyalist.
New termies is pretty obvious though I hope they look just as good as the metal ones, you can't beat those in coolnessfactor.
Obliterators, raptors and havocs are all great models so they don'ty need a change.
I do hope GW will provide us with options of equipping our vehicles with more chaos weaponry, reaper autocannons should be on more vehicles.

rac on a predator turret instead of the autocannon, twin rac's on the dreadnought similair to the mortis dred.

Cinara
02-01-2007, 10:22
Plastic upgrade sprues for each legion would be awesome. 5 Sonic Blasters and a Blastmaster on a sprue with some custom shoulders/helms and a doomsiren. Buying metal weapons that cost more than the model for each guy in a squad sucks.

Acheron,Bringer of Terror
02-01-2007, 12:16
Well, I'd like some of the newest models to be returne to the melting pot and thouroughly recast. Possessed anyone? :wtf: http://uk.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.uk?do=Individual&code=99110102095&orignav=10

Apart from that, I'd also like plastic terminators, better Berzerkers, new Sorcerers, all-plastic Havocs and perhaps a plastic Lord box.

The standard Marines are fine, in my tastes.

Serpent

Agreed !!! with the exeption of the new havoc - old H are good no need for upgrade yet

We also need new possessed, new dreadnought, and some older Power Armour on some models/not so much/

Kahadras
02-01-2007, 13:01
I'm of the opinion that it's high time that GW started seriously looking at seperating the Loyalist and Traitor Marines (models wise). Chaos Marines need the old marks of armour at least, along with new vehicle sprues. Terminators need to be redone as well (maybe a new look for them as well rather than just loyalists with spikes).

Kahadras

Kjell
02-01-2007, 13:06
Most models are good enough, but the ones I consider likely to be updated are:

Dreadnought
World Eaters
Terminators
Chaos Lord


The rest are up to the contemporary style and aren't as likely to be given new models. Not that it wouldn't be nice, mind you, but I think that power-specific accessories are the most we can look forward to as far as the Chaos Space Marines themselves getting an update goes. Maybe plastic Havocs and some miscellanous Champion metal miniatures.


Hopefully the battalion box will be worth getting... :p

Griffin
02-01-2007, 13:34
I love the current minnies even though older marks of armor would be be desireable. The only thing is plastic havocs...

Killgore
02-01-2007, 13:42
i dont like the current csm models at all, they dont look ld anouth, pre heresy armor types please

InquisitorNiels
03-01-2007, 02:24
Yes please no more top knots. Leave them for Orks! :cries:

Do you have any idea of when plastic chaos termi will be made, or if they will be done at all? I want to include a squad but dont like the current models and was going to get a box of the new plastic SM termis and convert them. If new models are on the way I will wait.

I dont want warped armour, maybe Im selfish but my NL dont live in the EoT, nor do most AL. So not everything has to be warped/deamonic. Some of us are not crazy, just evil.

FalseAngel
03-01-2007, 02:37
The plastic termies have already been made and forgeworld has made resin deathguard termies as well (much like they took it on themselves to make a deathguard dread with deathguard arms) HOWEVER they are being held back so they can either be released with the codex or part of a campaign (whichever comes first) thus making it easier to release the codex with shiny stuff but with less work.

EDIT: this basically means it'll be at least a year wait, so you might wanna go ahead and convert some if you need them for games

Brother Loki
03-01-2007, 16:23
I've never been fond of the big horns approach to chaos marines, and I hate the backpacks. The world eaters and night lord models are especially hideous.


I'd like to see them go one of two ways - either go to the archaic armor marks, or become more mutated, perhaps more like the original chaos renegade:

http://www.solegends.com/citle/citle1990/numbered/le101ChaosMarine.htm

Of the two options I would definitely prefer to see them in the older armour style.

On top of the 'standard' archaic power armour sprues, I'd like to see legion or power specific bits sprues, as well as a generic mutation sprue (with a few more actual usable mutations on it). I think this would be the most versatile way of doing things, but would result in a complete resculpt of the entire range, as opposed to simply recutting the normal CSM sprue to give more options, which I suspect is a more likely option.

Reaver83
03-01-2007, 16:42
having recently returned to 40K since 2nd edition, i think the beserkers aren't too bad, compared to the old ones at least.

Ithink sprues for CSM's for different legions would be great (and a non specific for other forces)

Plastic terminators again a great idea.

I personally love the old dreadnaughts...

Possessed, again not great, but possibly another plastic sprue?

otherwise perhaps a new unit, not sure what though!

bnf
03-01-2007, 17:42
I'd like them to make new Terminators, new Sorcerers, a new Dreadnought, new Berzerkers, better Possessed and some really nice looking Chosen in Power Armour.

TCUTTER
03-01-2007, 18:12
while were on the subject, would it kill gw to do a proper set of mutants and traitors, for thefact theres supposedly so many onside, and not metal either, plastic would be best. i also agree with the t visor idea, they look inherently evil

Lord Humongous
03-01-2007, 19:51
I rather like the current Berserkers, and even have a few of the old-school bolter toting versions (with modern arm swaps and such). I'd rather they keep those, and instead introduce a "chaos command squad" upgrade pack that Khorne players could use- Berserkers don't come with a power fist or any other HtH weapon upgrades!

The pack should include nice bits for making AC models, icon bearers, and so on, so that Chaos players don't have to buy metal squad leader models or do bits orders just to build a basic army. It could also include plain old "bling" for making your basic troops a bit nicer, maybe.

I don't really think plastic mutants are needed; its simple enough (and fun) to order various plastic troop sprues (IG, kroot, zombies, orcs, fantasy chaos, mutation sprue, etc) and mix-n-match. But some affordable plastic chaos hounds (maybe with conversion bits to also be flesh hounds) would be quite nice, IMO.

Same for traitors- there's plenty of options already for easy conversions, although if LatD becomes a "core" feature for chaos, I would like a box set with at least some conversion bits.

Overlord Krycis
03-01-2007, 20:05
The plastic termies have already been made and forgeworld has made resin deathguard termies as well...

Um...what? Did I miss something here, Resin Death Guard Terminators? :wtf:

Kjell
03-01-2007, 20:11
Same for traitors- there's plenty of options already for easy conversions, although if LatD becomes a "core" feature for chaos, I would like a box set with at least some conversion bits.

If the LatD become a proper part of the Chaos codex there would be boxes for both Traitors and Mutants. Unless I have been misinformed, it is now GW's policy to have an available model for every single usable unit. That's why we got metal Possessed all of a sudden. Apparently the whole "figure conversion" business is confusing for new players. Or something. :p

The pestilent 1
03-01-2007, 20:55
Okay then.
1: New dreadnought.
The old fellas showing his age now, preferably Plastic, but not simply the imperial one with an accessory sprue.

2: New Terminators.
Again, getting on a bit, preferably plastic in Pre-heresy style armour.

3: New vehicles.
Defiler is a good start, but I'd like some close-assault daemon engines, sporting flamers or whatever, again, not a modded defiler.

4: Chosen models, a medieval style to them (I just see Chosen sporting the oldest, most corrupt armour) I'm thinking something similar to the Warriors of Chaos from Fantasy in style here.

Acheron,Bringer of Terror
03-01-2007, 21:09
I don't really think plastic mutants are needed; its simple enough (and fun) to order various plastic troop sprues (IG, kroot, zombies, orcs, fantasy chaos, mutation sprue, etc) and mix-n-match. But some affordable plastic chaos hounds (maybe with conversion bits to also be flesh hounds) would be quite nice, IMO.

Same for traitors- there's plenty of options already for easy conversions, although if LatD becomes a "core" feature for chaos, I would like a box set with at least some conversion bits.

They are needed as well as Chaos Guard - you cant simply buy minis, assemble and play them :(

Lord Humongous
03-01-2007, 21:32
^^^I hope that was ironic. Because with some units / armies, the vary fact that there is no stock model is half the fun of fielding them. Its nice that they keep the occasion troop unit set aside for the "mad scientist" types among us who love fielding an ARMY of conversions.

Deadly Buddah
03-01-2007, 21:38
Personaly, new termies and older marks of power armor would be nice but what I'm realy hopng for is plastic deamons. It would be a literal godsend for my Wordbearers army.

Meticulous
03-01-2007, 22:49
I'd most like to see a radical departure from GW's 'if is has spikes, it's evil' stance, and look more toward subdued, baroque styles of armor and acoutrements. Older marks of armor, more detail -in- the model rather than -on- the model (the new Dire Avengers have given me renewed faith in detailed plastic miniatures, i.e. that they can be done).

Models-wise, most definately more in plastic. Legion upgrade sprues shouldn't be too hard (to my unelightened logic), since most of the bits are already sculpted, they just need to be turned into plastic from metal. Terminators are a must (get 'em up to size with Loyalists, and then us all that blank space to add detail).

I'm actually rather fond of the topknots, so...they can stay, heh.

No matter what GW put out though, it'll likely be at least satisfactory, if not great, as long as the guy who made the new Possessed is kept far away XD.

(Although the Aspiring Champion Possessed is kinda cool looking...)

Scorpion
03-01-2007, 22:53
I'll tell you what I don't what CSM to be: SM with spikes!

I mean, I like the concept of Chaos Space Marines! Mad, ravening traitors from an age long gone, driven insane by their desire of revenge, sworn to obey the darkest, most corrupting powers to enact their vengeance!

The problem is, the models don't say that. Instead, they say "OMG Sp1k3Z AR3 t3H c00L!!111!11!!!!!1!11" or "Lotsa chains and skullz and nasty rashes m4ke j00 t3h EVBIL!!1!1!!11!!!1"

I recently purchased a 3rd Ed. 40K Rulebook (It had much better fluff than the 4th Ed. one. Shame on you, GW!). There I noticed, in the armies showcase section (Page 223, if anyone cares to check), a model of an Iron Warriors CSM that really was everything a CSM should be: old, evil, with an unquenchable thrist for revenge! (as opposed to a Space Marine goth wannabe with anger management problems)

I'm one of those guys that thinks that, in many things, less is more. Such is the case of the Space Marines (Chaos or otherwise). Latelly, we've seen a phenomena I've came to dub the "Blingmarines". Two recent examples for that trend (parodied in the infamous Lord Maccrage/Playa image) are the Venerable Dreadnought (affectionatelly dubbed, "The Blingonought") and the Chaos Terminator Lord. Both were loaded with the most inconcievable and superfluous c**p know to man (and xenos). That doesn't make you look tough/evil, it makes you look ridiculous!

So, my objective sugestions?

- Less bling (chains, heads on spikes, chaos icons, etc...). Use it sparsely.
- We're talking of marines that served right after the Great Crusade. Chances are, they haven't renewed their hardware in 10000 years. Make their armour/aquipment look older! More clunkyness, exposed cabling, rivetted trims, older marks of Space Marine Armour... There's so much that could be done here!
- Go easy on the desease/mutation parts! (same as bling)

the1stpip
03-01-2007, 23:16
Definitely need new Slaaneshi sprue. it is a pain having a Slaanesh army and no sonic blasters simply cos I can't or won't pay £6 per marine.

I think the possessed are so crap cos GW felt they had to release them for the kids who know nothing about converting, but didn't want something that the more experienced players would use.

Personally, I have played Chaos since 2nd edition, and the only reason i took them was for the converting potential. Chaos and Orks have the most scope for converting.

Oh, and the Termie Lord was crap, as are the Spawn. Again another reason to convert...

FalseAngel
04-01-2007, 00:01
Um...what? Did I miss something here, Resin Death Guard Terminators? :wtf:

hehe Yup, it's true. Straight from the mouth of one of the FW sculptors. He said that the Chaos Militia models (in particular the daemon engines) were not going as fast as the DKoK because he was busy sculpting DG termies. It was said at a GD... I think Spain. It fell under the tidal wave of DKoK though so it wasn't discussed much...

Stormhammers
04-01-2007, 00:16
I'd most like to see a radical departure from GW's 'if is has spikes, it's evil' stance, and look more toward subdued, baroque styles of armor and acoutrements. Older marks of armor, more detail -in- the model rather than -on- the model (the new Dire Avengers have given me renewed faith in detailed plastic miniatures, i.e. that they can be done).



I was about to post the same thing, since when is it that when you turn evil, you suddenly put spikes and skulls on EVERYTHING!? I want CSM that look like "marines gone bad" not "marines gone goth"

InquisitorNiels
04-01-2007, 00:16
Do we have pctures of the said termies? If they look good I can wait, if not its time to make my own.

Marshal2Crusaders
04-01-2007, 00:46
if they use the t visors i will definatly be using them in some templar conversions

FalseAngel
04-01-2007, 03:38
No pics, they exist, but if we had pics I assure they would be on the rumour forum. I lurk the rumour forum all the time, so I assure you these are true statements and come from reliable posters with good histories on inside info. I would go ahead and convert for now though, they are game pieces after all, and sometimes it's more of a need than a want to the army.

eleveninches
04-01-2007, 10:40
The termies are still awesome models, despite thir age, although they could be re-done in better poses, much like the loyalist termies

adreal
04-01-2007, 13:17
Unfortunatly for you chaos players out there, you are going to be stuck with spikey marines. It's true and GW will never change it, because the spikes stick out and little Timmy wont get his momey to buy him the wrong models. I'm sorry but GW probably realise that their stuff is expensive, so make armies look different to aviod confusion.

Take High Elven and Dark Elven spearmen for example, both could concivably look the same, Elves don't tend to make fresh sweeping reforms to much, just use the tried and true. Yet Dark Elves are spiker, have chain mail and more detail on thier helms. Why? So someone that is fresh to the hobby, want's evil elves, can go into a GW store and with minimal fuss pick some up.

So, unless you are good at converting, you're stuck with your spikes

FalseAngel
04-01-2007, 16:43
That post really wasn't called for. This a curiosity topic, not a "hey GW change the models cuz we said so!!!!1!!one1!!" thread. I just asked because I was curious what the community thought, and people responded because they wanted to share their ideas and opinions. I love Warseer and the people in it, and I can tell from your number of posts that you do as well. So, please, don't come in and be a downer, just share your thoughts on what you think CSM SHOULD look like. I am a converter, so I'm sucking ideas from all of you. :chrome:

Jackster
04-01-2007, 16:49
Give us a Chaos Lord box set that actually has all the weapon choice like the SM commander box! Or atleast 5 kinds of Chaos lord model with different marks (like in fantasy)
Blister for Sonic weapons.
New CSM special weapon blister.
New Termies made of plastic.
New Dreadnought with two close combat hands and missile launcher blitz.
Bikes with all the weapon options.
I am really tired of trying to find stuff for my CSMs in SM model range.

kortholaxthedamned
04-01-2007, 16:57
As a Khorne player i'd like to see less static aspiring champions, i like the way they've done it, with the interchangable heads and weapons, but did the guy have to be just standing there? i wouldn't change much about the Bezerkers, apart from the bolt pistols. Oh, and a sprue similar to the special weapon sprue in the marine tactical squad set, but with plasma pistols (without the hands attatched), power fists, crazy axes and whatnot.

SpinO
04-01-2007, 18:17
A new Dreadnoght, terminators and a chaos lord would be nice. All plastic please;)

Zerosoul
04-01-2007, 18:24
Unfortunatly for you chaos players out there, you are going to be stuck with spikey marines. It's true and GW will never change it, because the spikes stick out and little Timmy wont get his momey to buy him the wrong models. I'm sorry but GW probably realise that their stuff is expensive, so make armies look different to aviod confusion.

Take High Elven and Dark Elven spearmen for example, both could concivably look the same, Elves don't tend to make fresh sweeping reforms to much, just use the tried and true. Yet Dark Elves are spiker, have chain mail and more detail on thier helms. Why? So someone that is fresh to the hobby, want's evil elves, can go into a GW store and with minimal fuss pick some up.

So, unless you are good at converting, you're stuck with your spikes

Or possibly...Just possibly...So that there's more of a visual range to the models. I know, it goes against the "GW IS EVIL AND WANTS TO SELL MODELS TO CHILDREN" angle, but it could be just crazy enough to be true.

spagunk
04-01-2007, 22:39
Did anyone watch the trailer for the WHFantasy game? the one where the guy powers up his hammer to fight the daemon? Well when i think CSM, i think of the ones they show in that CGI movie but with firearms and chainaxe's. Just huge deadly soldiers with glowing red eyes that show only the need to spill your blood. Definately how i would want my CSM's to look.

VenrableOne
04-01-2007, 23:40
I'd like to see them go one of two ways - either go to the archaic armor marks, or become more mutated, perhaps more like the original chaos renegade:

I have to agree with you here. Take them back in the original direction they were going. Archaic and mutated.

There’s a reason I'm saving all my mark 6 marines. They're going to become the basis for a chaos army.

guillimansknight
04-01-2007, 23:51
Okay then.
1: New dreadnought.
The old fellas showing his age now, preferably Plastic, but not simply the imperial one with an accessory sprue.

2: New Terminators.
Again, getting on a bit, preferably plastic in Pre-heresy style armour.

3: New vehicles.
Defiler is a good start, but I'd like some close-assault daemon engines, sporting flamers or whatever, again, not a modded defiler.

4: Chosen models, a medieval style to them (I just see Chosen sporting the oldest, most corrupt armour) I'm thinking something similar to the Warriors of Chaos from Fantasy in style here.

hold up, new chaos things?? ok i play SM and chaos, SM need NEW things not a smurf glorifying codex with adamant mantle being the only completly new thing. (no a modded LR does NOT count )
CSM can almost completly copy SM and use some chaos only stuff


but new models HELL YEAH (please new dread )

also i think the greater deamons need to be taken out after all deamon princes are very killy, GD's are just walking(or flying) CC nukes more of the deamon princes

sigur
05-01-2007, 00:05
I don't see any problems with CSM miniatures really. You can mix and match with regular SM miniatures which gives you the greatest variety of all 40k ranges. If you don't want your Night Lords to have bat wings attached to their helmets, just cut them off or use regular CSM. And I'm really sick of the spikes-thing. There aren't even many spikes on CSM, not much more than on regular SM and if, the spikes are additional bitz you can leave out if you wish. But think of one thing: Spikes, along with a few other thing, are what CSM makes different to SM. Hell, they're all "totally like really dark and grim and really, really gothic (HELL, are they GOTHIC!!!1) and brooding"....make them look different to an extend!

Generally speaking...CSM players, it's not that hard to convert your miniatures to fit your likings. Just go ahead, personalize your armies and don't shout at GW to "redesign" things. (remember when they "redesigned" 40k in '98 ;) :cheese: )

Flame Boy
05-01-2007, 00:22
One thing always bothered me... Why do Chaos space marines all have the wierd, branching backpack? Did they all sit down in a post-Heresy board meeting and decide to change their backpacks, or did the chaos gods decide it pleased them to make it harder for their servants to fit through doors? I never understood that really. It was helpful as a new player to know chaos marines were the ones with the silly backpacks, but that's not a good reason for the in-game setting in my opinion.

FalseAngel
05-01-2007, 00:52
Once again... I did NOT make this thread as a "hey GW change the models cuz we said so!!!!1!!one1!!" thread. However, that aside, thank you everyone for your thoughts.

On the topic of plastic dread (which had better come out) what do you all think of the CCW on the chaos dread? I kinda like the twisted wires 'n' claws one, but it's pose out of the box is rather odd for the rest of the body. Do you think they should make chaos dreads more like the fulff and rules say they are? As in driven completely psycho by all the pain and captivity they have to endure. Maybe more movement than what the loyalist dread shows?

Pavulon
05-01-2007, 06:41
My army is a mix of old metal DG and the new metal DG with FW DG dreads. I love all my models, even my 10 year old terminators. For the C:CSM release I'm mainly interested in them not screwing over my cult list al la 3rd edtion ( or was it 2nd, whichever one basicly forced us to play Black Legion with a few cult troops sprinkled in). I hated being a CSM army that just brought DG as troops. C:CSM hopefully will still allow me to field an entire army with MoN on it.

That being said, since DG is infantry based. 1 unit of MoN obliterators would be a serious help to my list. MoN devastators I can do without.

I will however say that if i didnt hvae a FW DG dread, I would want an updated dread model

And as beautiful as I think the DG models are, other legions have serious issues.

Night Lords have WAAY too much headgear.

Slaanesh looks they were designed by a blind sculptor.

Berzerker helmets I think are kinda dumb looking with the grinning skull kinda motif they have going on.

I wish Chaos bikes looked diffrent than SM bikes, right now CSM bikes are the same model as SM with a few extra spikes. Actually eldar bikes look good but every other motorcycle in the game is bad, with the Ork bike actually rating Horrible.

So to recap. If/when C:CSM is rereleased:
1. Don't screw with cult lists unless they are simply expanded.
2. Make some new bikes for the CSM's that can ride them.

Half Eldar
05-01-2007, 10:28
I'm with anti-spike crowd.

What I want to see is old armour, old weapons, old everything, but not overly mutated. This will of course not happen, but since the coolest Legions are far and away the Alpha Legion and the Thousand Sons, it would work for them. I would think both the Iron Warriors and the Night Lords could fit the 'not very mutated at all' mold.

I like the way the current marines are done, generally. I would prefer fewer spikes, protrusions, and getting rid of those horrible backpacks - were old Imperial ships equipped with wider doors? Instead I would like more gilding, wires, tubing, pipes, and chunkier equipment. Some beakie helmets would be good, but a wild variety would be best.


The upgrade sprue should of course have the special weapons, and enough spikes and bones and skulls that people who like that sort of stuff can add them.

I could go either way with the topknots - for whatever reason they invoke some rather rebellious streak, so they would make sense for some of the more disorganised legions, I guess. I think the design studio should look up every piece of pre Mk.7 equipment they've thought of for the marines, and take a few thousand years of damage and scratching to them.

Really I guess all I'm saying is I want pre-heresy marines. :p

Rioghan Murchadha
05-01-2007, 11:08
Hell, I'd just like to see enough thousand sons bolters and shoulder pads in a box for all 8 guys, rather than 6 shoulder pads and 3 proper hawkhead bolters.

bnf
05-01-2007, 12:13
One thing always bothered me... Why do Chaos space marines all have the wierd, branching backpack?

I don't think the regular CSM backpacks look silly, I think that design fits them well. The Berzerker backpacks however are *****...

Captain Stuart
05-01-2007, 16:21
My wish list is remove the spikes and horns. If I wanted a Conan aesthetic I'd be playing fantasy games. I'd also like an end to top knots. Geez, must every hair style be a top knot? Orks, Chaos, Tau, Eldar all have them. No wonder the SMs are so popular! :) If models must have these things, make them separate like the grenades and pistols so I can use them or not.

I think the only new things needed are a new dread. Minor recuts on the Berzerker sprue (to get the backpacks truly interchangeable and add some HTH weapon options) would be nice. Decent possessed models would be nice, but I don't expect that. Plastic havocs would be nice too since the normal Troops choice can have a wide variety of heavy weapons.

I doubt we'll see much older armor as it may be associated more with Death Guard than generic chaos. One must keep the models generic enough to accommodate a variety of specialized legions, yet make them different from space marines.

The greatest strength of Chaos models is their interchangeable nature with most marine parts. There's a good reason Imperial and Chaos marines tend to dominate golden daemon awards.

Kjell
05-01-2007, 16:36
A "Chaos Renegade Space Marines" plastic box featuring multipart renegades done in the old-school style and interchangeable with current SM and CSM ranges would be glorious. Some of them are charmingly bizarre and more elaborate mutation bits is always nice. I know I'd buy a box to mix in with the heap of unassembled regular CSM pieces I have already.

Lord Humongous
05-01-2007, 17:23
I don't think the regular CSM backpacks look silly, I think that design fits them well. The Berzerker backpacks however are *****...

Not only *****, they don't fit the models properly, while the basic CSM packs do. Why the HELL they don't just pack the CSM packs with Berserkers is beyond me. Then they could "accidentally" drop the mold for the berserker packs, and write it off on taxes.

Baldemyr
05-01-2007, 17:49
I enjoy the spikes, I enjoy the topknots- I dont see a problem with either. My only issue is that everyone is too uniform in appearance. There needs to be far more in terms of "random useless bits" to make chaos look more chaotic. Harmless things like tentacles holding a bolter-or oversized limbs...or perhaps varied helmets.
These men are lost- they were seduced down the wrong path and are hollow now, existing only for one purpose. They know it and embrace it. Trophies, "bling" and spikes are a part of that(the most bling-heavy character IMO was the Terminator Runepriest they made-WOW..although I love the bling)-for SOME groups. Other groups should be more uniform in appearance (like the 1000Suns or Iron Warriors).

Traditional armour marks need to be brought into it-but still include sprues with modern marine armour parts(replacements) and traditional terminators would go a LONG WAY to makeing them stand out.

Also, the Dreadnaught needs to be revamped. No more Space Marine shaped dreads. The mad minds in the Eye do not simply copy Imperial designs. It should resemble the Defiler to a greater extend..but come with an assortment of parts and even different ways to move it around battlefield.

If GW does it right, they will see a treasure trove of bits created and get all of us players-from whatever army-swarming over their addon parts. After all, this is chaos-not "EVOL"

Stormtrooper Clark
05-01-2007, 19:07
Most of the Chaos range i think is fine with the exceptions:

Bezerkers: Their alright, just update the Weapons (Their still using the 'old' Boltpistols)

Bikers: Same with Eldar Jetbikes, their just plain ugly.

Possesed: Do i really have to explain these?

Huw_Dawson
05-01-2007, 20:37
To make chaos space marines look decent, they should be slightly taller than normal space marines and have shedload of customisation spruces. Then you can have your iron warriors and thousand sons who are slightly normal, then crazy beggers like the world eaters with so many spikes you could hang up your washing on them. Obviously this is a bit... extreme though, and pretty unlikely. :P

If they made them look a little more... random, like that nice chaos dread from the 1st edition, then I would just love them all the same. :3

- Huw

EDIT: I agree with ST Clark a post above me, the possesed models are pretty poor, although I never saw why someone with ALOT of time, a CSM trooper box set and about 4 tonnes of Green Stuff could make models 100 times better. :P

Misanthrope
05-01-2007, 21:22
I like the Possessed models. I wouldn't buy the whole box of 'em but I pick some up in Blisters when I see ones I like.

And yes I too really think they should make the armour far more different. I'd love to see pre-heresy and heresy-era armour. Mark II to Mark V armour especially looks like it'd make for great-looking Chaos Marines (obviously upgraded with lots of chaotic enhancements). I'd also like to see a lot more gear and stuff. Chaotic gear. As it is we just get some grenades and silly fanny-pack looking things. Also I really hate the horned helmets. As for Berzerkers, which I have a lot of... the armour is okay, I don't completely agree that the bolt pistols need upgrading (they look like old-style bolters, which they should, not brand-spankin-new Imperium bolt pistols). Some of the helmets are ugly. The T-slit helm is great, and I like the skull face (though I don't particularly like the teeth, I'd prefer a vent like other helmets), and the other two are ugly. Also a Berserker Champion sprue would be great as it's generally accepted that Berserker squads NEED a power-fist Champion. I think thats a big oversight. I'd be happy if they just started including the CSM Champ sprue (and started selling them in boxes of 8 rather than 12, and also reduce the price by %25!)

Khaardun
06-01-2007, 00:55
to be honest, I think the chaos range is fine as it is, the terminator lord looks fine to me, and this whole talk about spikes, horns and whateverelse is something that I would like to point out, how else will chaos marines take down their victims if their weapons are out of ammo or broken?

in all honest if I recall, the renegades had horns and such, also with the issue on the nightlords helmets, I think they look fine, if they readjusted them, I think they would turn out ok, and also cutting them off you got some really nice and intresting helmet designs.

the thing I think people are not realising, is (if I remember rightly) GW have stated before that chaos is an army designed for conversions, the whole idea for chaos was conversions (because you can pretty much do anything for the look of your chaos marines). As I stated, I am fine with the current range, the only ones I dont like are the possessed, the berzerkers just need to have their gloves removed for the current chaos marine hands/gauntlets, and the terminators are fine, just they need to have more movement and such.

of course I would love to see some pre-heresy armour, and I would like to see the terminators in plastic, theres not much else I want changed or modified, simply because I tend to follow the ideal that chaos is not a 'set in stone look' army, rather with enough time each model can be very individual and such. I think what GW has done to the chaos marines, is to introduce them to the newcomers and younger gamers whom have little to no conversion skills and such.

but any ways thats my 2 pennies on what I think, and like I said, theres not much I want changed, if they do make changes I will just go ahead with it and see if its better or worse (considering chaos is, and always will be my first and last army)