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Witchfire
27-06-2007, 19:54
a bona fide slayer sword winner if there ever was one...

Vattendroppe
27-06-2007, 20:41
f-stop, or aperature.

Just curious, isn't f-stop and aperture the same thing?

TheWarSmith
28-06-2007, 00:34
I was pretty sure they were, yeah.

Vattendroppe
28-06-2007, 19:24
I was pretty sure they were, yeah.

Then I'm pretty sure they are.

pox
28-06-2007, 20:06
dunno, I thought f-stop was for video, and aperture for still photographs. either way, I suppose they work the same.

TheWarSmith
29-06-2007, 13:26
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F_stop

Inquisitor Konig
30-06-2007, 18:55
hold in there... BTW how much does that thing weigh!?

pox
30-06-2007, 23:51
the dragon weighs about 4 and a half pounds. and for a quick update, I had a very bad car accident. my son was with me, but thankfully he's ok. I was not so fortunate, and put my head through the driver side window, resulting in a massive concussion, and temporal amnesia. (I think thats what the doc said, basically 4-5 days of memory was deleted from my brain.) at any rate, with my son still in town, and with no car, all my free time is either going to my son, or trying to recover both my mind and my car. the CAT scan was negative, I can still remember how to paint and sculpt, but I cannot concentrate at all right now. all of this translates to nothing new on the dragon for at least a month, but in all likelihood I wont get to it until mid august, after my son goes back home. thanks everyone for their patience, it will be done by the end of the year, come hell or high water.

the_dark_sarge
01-07-2007, 00:08
wow that really sucks
poor you
i hope you son and you get better soon
and its lucky you can remeber to paitn and sculpt

best wishes
kieran

sir.spamalot
01-07-2007, 00:09
Damn....


just damn.

That is really really unfortunate for you, I'm terribly sorry about that accident, at least you can still remember how to hold a brush in your hand :D


cheers, get well

N810
01-07-2007, 05:11
Ouch!
my condolences.
Get well Soon.

Vattendroppe
01-07-2007, 11:01
Quite lucky something worse didn't happen! I'll be glad to wait, health first so to say.

Endemion
01-07-2007, 12:35
Hope everything works out well fr you. Time to concentrate on whats important, your health and your family

McMullet
01-07-2007, 13:23
It's this sort of thing that reminds you that there are more important things in life than toy soldiers, even splendid ones like yours, pox.

I'm glad your son was OK, and I wish you a speedy recovery. :)

sanctusmortis
01-07-2007, 14:56
OUCH! I return from holidays to news like this...

That's pretty bad, but I'm sure you'll pull through. A good month's rest and take it careful.

Ornithoticus
01-07-2007, 21:10
sorry to hear that pox, i know where youre coming from though, my dad had a car accident a few years ago and he was lucky to get away with minor brain damage

tzeentchgiant
02-07-2007, 01:31
Jesus, wow, hope you feel better, and I hope your kid isn't too shaken up over it :).

I suppose now would be the time to mention that just prior to your accident you promised to send me your model once it was finished, that and several blank cheques ;).

Seriously, get well soon :).

TG

eengaming
02-07-2007, 12:54
Sorry to hear about your accident. I hope you get better quickly.

Harry
02-07-2007, 19:14
Sounds like it could have been much, much worse.
Glad to hear your boy is OK.
Look after yourself.

All the best
Harry

de Selby
02-07-2007, 20:18
the dragon weighs about 4 and a half pounds. and for a quick update, I had a very bad car accident. my son was with me, but thankfully he's ok. I was not so fortunate, and put my head through the driver side window, resulting in a massive concussion, and temporal amnesia. (I think thats what the doc said, basically 4-5 days of memory was deleted from my brain.) at any rate, with my son still in town, and with no car, all my free time is either going to my son, or trying to recover both my mind and my car. the CAT scan was negative, I can still remember how to paint and sculpt, but I cannot concentrate at all right now. all of this translates to nothing new on the dragon for at least a month, but in all likelihood I wont get to it until mid august, after my son goes back home. thanks everyone for their patience, it will be done by the end of the year, come hell or high water.

Sorry to hear that, it puts things in perspective. Get well soon.

The Keeper of Secrets
02-07-2007, 21:23
Very sorry to hear that. Take a good break from modelling to recover. Get well soon.

Rogue 7
03-07-2007, 01:50
Eeesh. Glad to hear your son's alright. If you can remember warseer, what else do you need? :D But seriously, get well soon, and don't think you need to hurry back to work on our account- we're patient (wo)men.

Catferret
03-07-2007, 01:53
Get well soon Pox. This place won't be the same without you. Best wishes to you and your son.

ReclecteR
03-07-2007, 06:08
:eek: Geez. Hope you have a speedy and uneventful recovery. Good to hear nothing too major came of it though. I'm sure everyone on warseer wishes you well.
At least now you have a bit of leverage with the dice gods:rolleyes:

pox
03-07-2007, 07:03
thanks to everyone for their kind words, its makin' stuff easier to deal with. still having trouble concentrating, but its getting better. still got mad skill, just can't use it for more then an hour without headaches.

on the plus side, I do believe my new car is going to be a fully-loaded Lincoln towncar. considering my last car was a honda hatchback, I'm gonna be damn near stone-cold pimpin'.

(oh man, I gotta stop talking to my twenty-something dishwashers.)

The Dude
03-07-2007, 07:05
Yeah, my respect for you has dropped quite a lot with that, Pox ;).

Rest up and relax. You deserve it.

titan136
03-07-2007, 13:31
sorry to hear about your accident, thank god your kid's ok. get well soon....wait scratch that, get well now!

ChromeZephyr
03-07-2007, 18:21
...come hell or high water.

Well, looks like you've already covered the hell, and the high water is in Kansas and Texas...so, you're good to go, smooth sailin' from here on out. ;)

Been lurking while you've been sculpting/painting this beast, and words can't express how awed I am it. Swift recovery, sir, and can't wait until you get back to it.

armos
03-07-2007, 19:38
get well soon man.. but take your time

best wishes

Ornithoticus
03-07-2007, 21:47
thanks to everyone for their kind words, its makin' stuff easier to deal with. still having trouble concentrating, but its getting better. still got mad skill, just can't use it for more then an hour without headaches.

I'd go and get this checked out if i where you, my dad had a similar thing after his accident and they didntassess him properly at the time and it took 6 months before they realised the extent of his injury and in that time he developed a brain injury that might have been preveted. so it might be worth it to go and get a second opinion

Marked_by_chaos
03-07-2007, 22:13
second that. Somethings are just more important. I'd love to see the finished model as much as the next poster but health should always come first.

feeder
14-07-2007, 03:37
Hi, I understand that updates are far away and with good reason,
HOWEVER, this project is far too cool to not be on the front page.
I wish you a speedy and full recovery.

pox
14-07-2007, 06:53
just a quick life update, no progress thus far. :(
I'm much better, and my brain seems back to full strength. I have to get a second job to pay for all the medical bills and new car, but this is actually good for the dragon. I'm gonna be working in a friends video store, and for the 35 hours a week, I will pretty much paint the whole time. I don't start for a month, but as soon as I do, I will have massive updates every week pretty much until the dragon's done.

Vattendroppe
14-07-2007, 08:00
I love you, pox.

sanctusmortis
14-07-2007, 12:07
Don't rush it, fella. Take your time, don't do anything you don't feel up to, and above all make sure you know you're better rather than feel better.

We are, surprisingly, quite a patient lot, and would rather see a healthy nd fine you work on a labour of love than a slightly ill you slog at something that needs doing.

fleshcross
14-07-2007, 16:53
Oh sweet, you got a job at Manny's? I mean, sucks you have to have a second job, but if you've got to have one, well, not many better places you could be!

pox
14-07-2007, 21:08
ya, I'm working at paradise lost. I can paint, sculpt, play dead rising/FFXII, and watch awesome movies. sucks to be me! :)

tzeentchgiant
14-07-2007, 21:12
ya, I'm working at paradise lost. I can paint, sculpt, play dead rising/FFXII, and watch awesome movies. sucks to be me! :)Lest we forget, you get paid for this privilege too :p.

Good luck on your recovery :).

TG

Some Muppet
14-07-2007, 21:35
u are a lucky buggar and a blinking coold sculptor too (not to shabby at painting either) shame about the accident, atleast u were not too badly hurt (and u didn't write ur car off ;)) can't w8 for the next update!

Jokre
27-07-2007, 07:28
Good news. I can't wait to see progress.

sir.spamalot
27-07-2007, 14:02
Wow that is good news, can't wait for the updates:)

Gralph!?!
27-07-2007, 16:02
man that sucks, but it is good to hear you are getting better.

a bit of critism though. looking at the head, it looks fantastic but the horns and such aren't doing it any justice. by that i mean the paint job on them, try if you can to blend the colours a bit more, a brownish tink on the bone close to the bottom then let it get stronger.

with the teath and bigger flat horns, i like what you have done with them but if you wanna add more details on them then it will be a good idea to get yourself a fine detail brush and try to do the thin, thin lines going up from where the flesh starts.

if you look at the horns on the new gorbad model then you will see what i mean by it.

i also hope i am not over stepping my bounds here but when i see something this brilliant i always try to help that person improve it.

pox
27-07-2007, 21:44
criticism is what makes an artist better. if I don't feel challenged, through myself or others, I stagnate and don't improve. even outlandish, coarse, and harsh critics have a way of seeing the model in ways I cannot. trust me when I say, all comments are appreciated.

just two more weeks till I can paint on it!!!! I can hardly wait!

fleshcross
28-07-2007, 02:58
Bah, you need to scratch this and build another Kult of Speed army! Maybe with a Kult of Speed Stompa...

Asi the Red
28-07-2007, 04:43
Hey ya'.

Couple of things:
1. Glad you've recovered/are recovering well from your accident, but look on the bright side - at least the model wasn't in the car with you. ;)
2. There are no words in my present vocabulary to express the sheer awesomeness of that scuplt.
3. The teeth. Maybe it's just me but for a giant, bad@ssed Chaos Dragon that eats lead and spits guns that shoot swords (yeah, it's that BA'd!) the teeth look really... well... clean. Like it just got back from the dentist or something, except for the long teeth coming from just below the horns on the top jaw they just look too clean. Where's the plaque? Where's the wear? Where's the chipped tooth from when some chump he was about to eat took a swing and nicked a tooth?

pox
25-08-2007, 23:16
so, I have time to paint again. I will still have spotty updates for a while, I'm painting for cash to make ends meet. (just finished the battle for skull pass for my local shop.) at any rate, I want to finish the dragon by Christmas. its strange coming back to a project I haven't worked on in a while, but the time off has helped, I think. the first new goal I have is to make sure my color choices are right. so to that end, I will be painting the torso first, as its the only piece to have all the textures of the dragon. its also helping in that its the most boring piece to finish, so with it out of the way I get to have fun with the awesome bits.

I am also not trying to win the golden daemon anymore. I still plan on entering it, and will still do my best, but I have come to accept I don't have the skill. I have learned so much from doing this, that I think the next project down the line could win, or maybe the one after that. basically, I find I'm too paralyzed to work on it, and decide to do something else. if it never gets finished, I can't even play with it, haha. I still am open to advise/suggestions/comments, all thats really changed is my attitude, and my over all goals. anyhow, onto the pictures!

first up is the base coat of the dragons skin
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dragontorso_001.jpg

followed by shots of his stomach and leg wounds

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dragontorso_002.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dragontorso_003.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dragontorso_004.jpg

next update in a sec, I got some nice arm/wing wounds. the random spikes around the torso are not finished, only the teeth in his tummy.

pox
25-08-2007, 23:20
here are the arm/wing tendons and rot. the edges of the flesh are not done, and I'm still trying to figure out how to sneak some rotten green in there.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dragontorso_005.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dragontorso_006.jpg

and a good long shot, hopefully showing how far the tendons stick out.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dragontorso_007.jpg

I'm painting tonight, so I will have an update either tonight or tommorow afternoon.

soultaker87
26-08-2007, 04:38
OMG!!! I never knew there was that much detail at the body till you painted it. awsome love the gore and guts. best looking gory paint job

Braad
26-08-2007, 09:50
I really don't understand why you are so negative about your skills... this really looks fine mate!

Only the white parts sticking out of his body might be a bit more gory, they look very clean. But I guess you're nowhere near finished, so just keep up the good work!

unwanted
26-08-2007, 13:52
Wow, it keeps getting better!

It's a really amazing project, can't wait to see it finished!

tinfoil
28-08-2007, 11:52
Awesome to see this project back! The painting really brings out the amazing detail in the sculpting, pox. It's just such an incredible piece.

N810
29-08-2007, 11:41
have you tried messing with inks, washes, or glazes yet?

pox
29-08-2007, 22:25
all three are on the dragon. the base coat is 25% water, and all layers after 50% water. most parts have thin washes for the last step, or thinned inks. the glazes will come into effect after the whole model is finished, either from spot gloss layers, or heavier epoxie glue for ultra-shiny, textured effects. (mostly around the tounge and mouth areas.)

the blood is full non-diluted inks, first a red then magenta layer. I'm fairly decent at gore, my other hobby is horror-movie make up, and gore prop dressing. its just a tad easier when full scale, rather then an effect on a tiny miniature. :) I should have another picture update later today, I am painting for the next six hours, and just wanna do a mega-update. the torso is almost done!

pox
30-08-2007, 04:42
on with the update!

heres a shot of the wing tendons with the surrounding skin finished. I keep trying techniques on the wound edges that work on a larger scale, but haven't had a lot of success. I'll keep trying till it looks how I want it to.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/woundtissue.jpg

here's a shot of the barnacles scales with green mutation stuff, the green might be a bit too bright, I'll finish the fish fins before I decide. they're bright purple, and it looked good on the tail, just not sure if its gonna clash with all the browns.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/barnacles.jpg

here's what the scales and horns look on the other side of the dragon, along with a few tentacles bursting out of his body.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/drag2.jpg

and finally, I started working on the wound track the maggot left.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/drag1.jpg

as I said before, I'm doing the torso to finalize my color choices, as its the only piece that has them all. I will finish it before making final decisions. after that, its just a matter of applying all the colors and techniques to the rest of the dragon.

The Dude
30-08-2007, 04:48
The green looks fine. I think it's a great counter-point to the red, and it fits with the overall earthy tones of the body. Are the hard part of the barnicles staying black?

I really like the brightness of the horns and teeth. It really makes them stand out.

Keep it coming Pox :D

pox
30-08-2007, 04:54
yeah, thats the final barnacle color. its actually about seven layers, hard to get a good pic of. I did the scales on the western side the same color, in the hopes of unifying the dragon overall. the jury's still out on that though, but I think the grey/black spotted scales would look great on the western head. (they are red right now, for those that dont want to dig through 12 pages for the last pic)

Harry
30-08-2007, 07:20
Wow. I loved this project before but you painting is really showing how much work is in the sculpting....and it is magnificent.

I don't know why you are so down on your painting either. I think your making a fantastic job of it and the bits you have completed so far look great.

One of the 'problems' you have is that you are looking at the tiny part you are painting, (with a very critical eye) and feel your painting is coming up short but the fact is that much like painting a big unit of core troops even if the painting of some of the tiny details is not perfect , overall, the unit can look amazing... fact is... no one is ever going to look at this model again under quite such a 'magnifying glass' as you do now nor with such a critical eye. (Even were it in a Golden Demon Cabinet!)

I honestly think once this model is all put back together that taken as a whole, just from what we have seen already, the painting will look incredible.

I think its great that you ahve taken the pressure off yourself and are enjoying painting it (and clearly cracking on again! nice one). However I still think, on completion, even though you will go on to do 'bigger and better' things in the future (Trying to imagine something grander than this and coming up short!) you should definitely still bung this into a GD competition.

You might suprise yourself. I think others may rate the time effort and skill that has gone into this beast more highly than you do yourself.

Great to see you back and doing such inspiring work.

pox
30-08-2007, 13:23
I don't mean to knock my skills so much, and I am I tad critical when looking at the dragon through a judges eyes. the thing is I know it could be done better, but I can't paint it thinking that way. It is coming along nicely, and your right, I think the whole will be quite greater then the parts. I just needed the mental trick to keep painting it, and that trick was to go back to painting it for myself, rather then for GD. I WILL enter it next year, barring life stopping me from going. I have spent far too much time on this NOT to show it off.

and besides, you guys gotta see this in person, its bigger then a damn titan.:)

N810
30-08-2007, 14:40
oh don't forget about stains and varnishes,
you can brush some of those to pick up
shadeing and add wetness to the gore. :evilgrin:

Death Korp
30-08-2007, 16:51
That has to be one of my favourite models of all time! Honest. That thing screams 'CHAOS!' well, not really...but you get my point. Are you going to be using it as Galurach or wahtever its called?
DK

beefpizza
30-08-2007, 22:45
I haven't said much lately, but I thought now would be a good time to say how much I have enjoyed seeing you progress on the whole project and now, with the painting it is really showing off all of the detail that you did.
Awesome work!

Inquisitor Konig
30-08-2007, 22:48
This is so lovely! Personaly I would have to say that the green does look a little too bright. Toneing it back to a deep green might be a good idea.

However it is hard to make a good judgment when only looking at one side at a time. Not to mention when you give it Purple Fins the green might not stand out as much.

This thing is going to be so crazy looking it probebly doesnt matter what colours you use!!! Keep it up, we are all rutting for ya.

Dragon of the Pants
30-08-2007, 22:51
Every single time I see new pictures I am floored. This is the sweetest model ever, and I want one for my chaos army.:p

aenimosity
31-08-2007, 01:23
Good to see you back at it again mate. Can't wait to see this beast put together.


Keep it up, we are all rutting for ya.

LOL :D

pox
31-08-2007, 05:16
thanks everyone for all the comments and compliments. to touch on a few points, the shape and brightness of the horns on the western side is to counter-balance the size and brightness of the fish fins. hopefully. as to rules, he's for my beast of chaos army, which is all unaligned right now. I would only use him in large games, and would prolly use the "giganto chaos dragon forgeworld" rules. look em' up, hes around 1,000 points, and has ten wounds. (and a unit strength of 30, IIRC.) the other option is the new dragon is gonna be mounted on a chariot base. I may add 50mm to his base, enough room for a chapion to stand in front of him, and use him as a regular lord mount. All that is the horse before the cart, I need to finish him first!

the torso's almost done, here's a left side shot, and a top shot.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/1-1.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/4-1.jpg

here's a close up of the maggot wound and the bone texture of his western tail. the tail came out ten times better then I thought it would, it looks exactly the way I envisioned it. that texture is very important, it runs the full length of the tail. the maggot wound track needs some work, it should at-a-glance explain the maggot is a foreign entity. (I also need to finish the inside of the barnacles, I just noticed.)

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/3-1.jpg

last but not least, a close up of the tentacle explosion around the base of the right wing. its a bit hard to make out how its gonna look, but it meshes nicely with the fish in the wing.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/2-1.jpg

alrighty, I should have updates this weekend, I'm painting fri-sat-sun, with just a quick break to go see the train wreck that is the Halloween re-make. (I hope its not crappy, but best to prepare for the worst.)

manickze
31-08-2007, 08:02
the dragon is very cool, the halloween remake...not so cool.:rolleyes:

PMTN
31-08-2007, 15:13
When I first looked at this project I thought, "nothing ever painted will ever do justice to the sculpt". But this is an amazing project.

Not matter how many time people have complimented you, I will do it again, this is truly a fantastic project. I only hope I can see it in person.

Vattendroppe
31-08-2007, 15:27
I thought I'd balance up those heaps of compliments and glory you've got from ppl by asking if you were going to highlight the grey spine (?) peice sticking out from his back a quite long way down. Since I'm too lazy to edit a pic myself to show what peice I mean I hope you get what I mean. That thing that is seen ti the left in the third pic, beside the beginning of the tail.

And then just to make the plog justice:
OMGWTFBBQ!!!11shift

tinfoil
31-08-2007, 15:34
One bit of (hopefully) constructive criticism: the maggot looks kind of mechanical -- as opposed to organic. Each of the segments seems perfectly rounded and same-sized. Is there any way you can make it look somehow rougher or less geometrically rounded? If you don't want to go back to green stuff (which I could understand, at this point in the project), perhaps with varying the paint blending patterns along the segments?

L192837465
31-08-2007, 17:22
i just wanted to give you shout out. this is pretty much by far the absolute coolest thing i have ever seen in my lifetime of gaming (10+ years). you should seriously be inducted into some hall of fame. a golden deamon is not enough to glorify this beautiful monstrous mutilation of clay sex. if someone were to model the embodiment of sex gone wrong, this is 100% it.

pictures do not do it justice. this rant doesnt do it justice.

absolutely amazing. props to you, your family, your parents, and anyone you've ever seen ever in the history of ever. your glory cannot be contained to just one person.


anyways, fantastic model. you should get ahold of a 10Mp camera or such and take a really big high res shot and attach it to your next update. i wanna see all the intricacies :D

pox
31-08-2007, 22:22
thanks again everyone, your compliments keep me working on it. the grey thing is the part of the maggot that goes into the torso, I'm painting it today. it is very smooth, I hope to make it less mechanical with paint. I wanted it to be smooth, so its texture would be distinct from the rest of the dragon. the maggot has become kind of a sticking point, I hope it comes out ok. in the sculpting phase, it became important for a central eye focus, allowing the heads to be facing in different directions. it looked a little wonky without something in the middle, once I decided to drop the rider. I'm painting it today, so should have pics either today or tomorrow.

as for hi-res shots, my camera can do them. I have a 7.1 mp, but don't use the biggest size to avoid table breakage. (I'm too used to posting on somethingawful, where thats a probational/bannable offence, depending on the mod's mood.) at any rate, I'll post a hi-res shot once I get him mounted back on his base, and can move him around a bit easier.

thanks again everyone!

The Dude
01-09-2007, 03:06
the grey thing is the part of the maggot that goes into the torso, I'm painting it today. it is very smooth, I hope to make it less mechanical with paint. I wanted it to be smooth, so its texture would be distinct from the rest of the dragon. the maggot has become kind of a sticking point, I hope it comes out ok. in the sculpting phase, it became important for a central eye focus, allowing the heads to be facing in different directions. it looked a little wonky without something in the middle, once I decided to drop the rider. I'm painting it today, so should have pics either today or tomorrow.

What colour are you going with for the Maggot? I was a bit worried myself that it would stay black, as I really think it needs to stand out, as you have said, as a foreign object.

speedygogo
02-09-2007, 00:14
I can see why you had to take the dragon apart to paint it. It looks great so far I can't wait to see it finished.

pox
02-09-2007, 02:25
remeber how I said I was gonna paint the whole torso before I changed my mind on any colors? well, I suck at concept work, and get caught up in the moment. alas, for good or bad, the damage has been done.
In all seriousness, two major changes have occurred. I decided that I did want the barnacles on the water side and the scales on the western side to be different colors. I was loving how the horns gave it the bright-yet-evil effect, and thought I would take a risk by doing the scales in the same tone. that worked out quite well. the other thing was deciding on pastel blue for the maggot. pics first, then discussion.

A side shot of the scales and maggot,
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/blue1.jpg

followed by the new highlighted wound track and maggot,
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/blue2.jpg

And finally, the maggots smile. (teeth need a bit of yellow, I think.)
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/blue3.jpg

I am open to suggestions if the blue seems a bit off, but I want to explain why. I knew pastel would work the best, as most of the dragon is solid coloring. purple was out, too close in color to the fin. (as not yet painted, but I do have the sample tail piece for color matching.) green, pink, and white all for the same reason. I thought blue might work best, for two reasons. one, nothing on the dragon is going to be blue. two, in my eyes, it seems to compliment the other colors, and you can readily pick out the maggot detail now, once I finish the dead edges of the flesh. its just very noticeable, and I like it.

it did take some time for me too see it that way, so I am very curious how y'all see it. any and all comments/suggestions/impressions would be very appreciated. I am painting the fin tonight and tomorrow night, after that, no more decisions to make, I just take all my painting notes and the rest becomes paint-by-number.

looking at the pic, I see the maggots' teeth need a bit more detail. and a quick note on the gloss, its hard to hold, so I use a nice, thick non-yellowing gloss coat from time to time for protection. the final coat wont be until its assembled, wherein I will matte the whole thing, then semi-gloss, gloss, and super gloss all the parts as needed.

The Dude
02-09-2007, 03:24
I am open to suggestions if the blue seems a bit off, but I want to explain why. I knew pastel would work the best, as most of the dragon is solid coloring. purple was out, too close in color to the fin. (as not yet painted, but I do have the sample tail piece for color matching.) green, pink, and white all for the same reason. I thought blue might work best, for two reasons. one, nothing on the dragon is going to be blue. two, in my eyes, it seems to compliment the other colors, and you can readily pick out the maggot detail now, once I finish the dead edges of the flesh. its just very noticeable, and I like it.

No it's just right. As you have said, nothing else is blue, so it highlights the foreign nature of the Maggot, makes it seem a seperate entity, which is important in something as warped as this Dragon.

The blue is also a great counterpoint to the earthen tones of the rest of the Dragon.

I agree that some yellowing on the teeth would be good, as this would also differentiate it's teeth from the clean white teeth, spikes and horns of the Dragon and it's various mutations.

Now, back to the paint mill Pox! :p

Edit: I must say though, that personally I preferred the black scales. It seemed to tie the two halves together and suggested a common heritage for the scales and barnicles, as if the barnicles were once scales that mutated. It still looks tops though ;)

pox
02-09-2007, 04:25
I think the breaking point on the scales is gonna be the western head. I'll knock that out next. they cover the head, so the scale color is going to be the dominate color of the dragon. the one advantage looking at the bone scales is I can go a bit lighter on the flesh, something I can readily see on the head. (its currently a bit lighter then the body, so we shall see the results immediately.)

the good news about the scales is they're an easy fix, and can be painted on multiple times. I like the bone simply because they pull detail out from a distance, its pretty striking from across the room, and still holds up on close inspection. the fish fin is almost finished, that will change the composition a bit too. I'm just happy that its moving along nicely, and its back to being fun to work on. it feels like a puzzle now, not like punching a brick wall.

McMullet
02-09-2007, 14:21
Pox, I'm going to have nightmares about that maggot. *shudders*

I really like the way the blue looks, but I do have one thought: Shouldn't the maggot be covered in blood and gore? I know we are talking about something here that is, 1. a dragon, and 2. mutated by Chaos, so invoking realism seems a bit odd, to say the least. Perhaps just a little red around the edges, or a wash or something might work? I'm not sure if it wouldn't spoil the look of the blue though, so it might just be better to leave it, and attribute the non-gore-covered nature of the maggot to magic...

Anyway, I continue to be amazed by the sheer awesomeness of this project.

pox
02-09-2007, 23:06
one thing I have been thinking about is whether or not to do "wear" effects on the dragon in general, not just the maggot. A lot of the suggestions in general are about how clean it looks, the teeth in the mouth for instance, or having more blood flow from his wounds. its something I would like to do, kind of dirty it up a bit, but I'm not sure if I have the skill.
I'm gonna finish the fin and post pics before tonight.

The Dude
03-09-2007, 00:52
I have absolutely no problem with it looking clean. I think some people go OTT with blood and gore. With things like the mouth in its guts, the cleanliness of the teeth really helps to highlight that it is indeed a mouth, and not a rupture full of spines.

The horns can be clean, as they have grown from the flesh (un)naturally, and the tentacles are the same. I really love the cleanness between the pink of the tentacles and the white of the spines in them. It reminds me of teeth and gums.

All of these mutations can occur in one of two ways, either a steady morphing from one state to another or a violent rupture of new growth. Which ever of these change states is occurring will determine how you paint it. Personally I’m all for the steady morph, indicated by no blood or gore beyond the bits that are clearly wounds.

As for the Maggot, generally maggots don’t eat living flesh, and so they don’t get covered in blood as they burrow. I feel putting streaks of gore, however minor, would blur the edges between the Maggot and the Dragon, and it is the clear separation of the two that really works for me.

That said, it’s up to you, and if this is a Maggot that eats living flesh, then gore it up.

pox
03-09-2007, 04:18
ok, here's the finished torso color-wise. I think I am going to keep it clean. the gore speaks for itself, and the maggot works best seeing it pushing through the flesh. I think streaked gore would ruin that. I still need to find a better wound edge, I think a bit of experimenting should get that squared away.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/fintor1.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/fintor3.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/fintor2.jpg

so my thoughts are my color choice and painting style really bring out the detail, but make it look a tad cartoony. having lived in new Orleans for a while, the green and purple are too close to mardi-gras colors, and I probably will wind up muting or paling the green. I think I'm going to keep the bone color for the scales, one of the things I can do with it is brighten the basic flesh a bit, something I had wanted to do, but didn't look right with the gray scales.

so these are the final colors, I am open to any suggestions/thoughts/ideas, if nothing else jumps at me, I'll make those changes I talked about and re-post the final torso.

looking at the pics, I think I might darken the scales to match the dark bone color of the western tail. it would make the scales match the wing and tail bones, and off-set the white horns a bit better.

let me know what y'all think!

The Dude
03-09-2007, 05:04
I think the Green is fine, but the Purple is a bit much. You can get away with the green because there isn't quite as much of it, but that much purple in one spot is rather... garish.

I think you may be able to retain the purple by simply making the spines between the webbing bone colouerd. This would break it up and tie it in with the spikes on the western half.

skullman86
03-09-2007, 06:31
I like the purple and green on the right hand side but the left side isn't as appealing.I think it may have something to do with the large amounts of red and white on that side where the right side has the green to balance everything out.The maggot looks really nice and I know it is supposed to be a foreign object but it stands out a little too much IMO.If it were a yellowish color like a real maggot I think it would still be recognized as a separate entity but the yellow would compliment the whole piece where that light blue currently draws all attention away from the dragon (for me anyway).You could also make it glossy to help it stand out as well.Gore would be nice but too much and it will blend in with the flesh as everyone has already said.

Well there's my 2 cents and I'm looking forward to the next update :)

manickze
03-09-2007, 07:17
Yeah the maggot would look a lot better in a sickly transluncent pale yellow. Whilst I think you have too many contrasting colours the painting is awesome.

The Dude
03-09-2007, 07:24
I agree with the gloss on the maggot. It would invoke a slimy, mucus coated borer. Filthy :D

Whilst I originally thought a yellow would be good for the Maggot, I think the blue works quite well

fleshcross
03-09-2007, 07:45
Looking good Mark! I'm glad you're back to painting again, I can't wait to see this thing finished.

By the way, can I get some of those Mardi Gras beads from you? :D

Vattendroppe
03-09-2007, 18:26
It's just so beautiful...

Inquisitor Konig
03-09-2007, 18:54
Personaly I like all the different bright and dark colours. If you tone them too closesly all the beautiful modeling detail might wash out and be harder to see.
Just a thought.

pox
03-09-2007, 21:45
ok, I agree with everyone on the yellow maggot, I'm gonna try it. after a bit of thought, the purple does need to be broken up a bit, and the green in the barnacles muted a tad. I'm gonna go with the dudes suggestion of bone spines on the fish fin, which should fix the too much purple problem. if that doesn't work, I might go with a color fade to red, but thats getting ahead of myself. I already changed the scales to match the wing bones, it looks sweet.

I know I'm rambling, I should have pics today or tomorrow. (got a game tomorrow too, gonna kick some wood elves ass with my beasts of chaos.)

Grenswick
05-09-2007, 02:02
Gorgeous.

I think the western side looks astonishing and the pale blue on the maggot not only is original but works great with the western side. Although I do agree that something about the purple and green doesn't quite work. I can't quite remember what the fish tail looks like, but I do remember that I thought it was fantastic. Did you change the colour on that or was it the purple that I see here?

pox
06-09-2007, 05:31
I changed quite a bit on the dragon. after bantering with you good people, I took a few days off to stare at it for a bit. (didn't hurt that I had no days off this week from work.) I decided that the purple looked fine on the tail, but was a bit too much for the whole spine. I painted it to match the wings.
I also changed the scales to better match the earth tones, and finally found the gore-edge I was looking for on the wounds. it takes a bit of time to do, so its only around the maggot hole for now, I will apply it to all the other wounds when I get a chance.
the only other change was the removal of a small bit of flesh that I felt was obscuring the maggot entrance, the maggot is much easier too see now. after I was done with everything else color-wise, I decided I liked the blue maggot, so its gonna stay that color. (still gonna make the teeth yellow at some point.

here's the three-sixty.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/1-2.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/2-2.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/3-2.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/4-2.jpg

all thats left on the torso is clean up, the colors are pretty much fleshed out. (barring a brilliant suggestion from you, the gentle reader.) the main reason I say this is I'm sick of painting the torso, I'm gonna move on to another part for a while. what do you want to see painted next? your options are:
1. boring left wing.
2. exciting right wing with fish in it.
3. super tentacle tail.
4. the base with mutated right arm wrapping around it.
5. the super-claw left arm.
6. the western head.
7. the lamprey head.
8. boring maggot tail.

I get home tomorrow afternoon, the most votes wins it by then.

(one vote per poster. I may paint whatever the hell I want anyway. not eligible in the state of north Dakota. void where prohibited. may contain peanuts.)

The Dude
06-09-2007, 05:43
I decided that the purple looked fine on the tail, but was a bit too much for the whole spine. I painted it to match the wings.

Will you be blending it in to purple on the tail, or just leaving the tail fin purple on it’s own? I would prefer the former (though I’m sure that’s what you will be doing :p)


I also changed the scales to better match the earth tones

That’s better, They were a bit stark before.


I decided I liked the blue maggot, so its gonna stay that color. (still gonna make the teeth yellow at some point.

Good for you. I like the Blue maggot too. It gives an otherworldliness to it (beyond its ridiculous size of course ;))


what do you want to see painted next?

Well I’d like to see how the fish tail will blend with the torso, but out of shear practicality, I’d say go for the base, that way you can take some semi assembled shots for us too :D

pox
06-09-2007, 06:00
I will be blending the purple into the brown, luckily when I painted the tail, I had to hold about an inch of detail, so it should be easy to do. if I did the base first, I could in fact mount the body too it.

The Dude
06-09-2007, 06:13
I will be blending the purple into the brown, luckily when I painted the tail, I had to hold about an inch of detail, so it should be easy to do.

It was meant to be :p


if I did the base first, I could in fact mount the body too it.

That was what I was thinking. Build it as you go :D

Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it!

tinfoil
06-09-2007, 13:25
Looking really really good! I like the toned down purple, and the way the scales work with the overall scheme. And the maggot works really well.

Dang, I love this thread!

edit: I was going to vote for the fish wing, but I see Dude's point about moving on to (onto) the base.

Catferret
06-09-2007, 13:41
Yup, here's another vote for the base.

Models always look complete when the base is done, even if you only have 3 basic colours on the rest of the model. It may give you a sense of completion inspiring you to keep going with the rest of it rather than looking at all the unstarted sections and thinking it'll never end.

Grenswick
06-09-2007, 13:46
I really like the new scheme for the aquatic dragon. For some reason, when i saw it I got a distinct Godzilla/Creature from the black lagoon feel....as though it recently crawled out of some briny depths or something.

Me being the boring rationalist, would say do all of the boring bits first to give you better incentive to go till the end. Ie. save the best for last you know? But I also think painting the bas would be a good idea, in other words...paint whatever the heck you want.

Vattendroppe
06-09-2007, 19:31
I'd say that you'd start of with the base, that way you'll have a better way to store it without having to worry about the painting scraping off the miniature. Then go with pieces so that it keeps some kind of balance.

pox
06-09-2007, 20:57
sounds like the base it is! oh and catferret, I passed "never going to end" six months ago.by my reckoning, I could have six more painted armys, but instead I made a dragon.

well, back the the grind.

Starks333
06-09-2007, 21:43
not bad, good to see you are back at work :)

changing the purple on the spine was a good choice

you need to decide what the main focus of the model is, and form your colours towards it, too many focual points and the story is lost

suggestions:

if you wanna keep the magot that colour mix in green and brown for shades, and then do some light planned stains with redish/brown to show the bloodyness covering it....if you wanna change it to yellowy, mix purple and yellow for the base colour, shade by adding in more purple and mix in some green(like catachan) and maybe brown

next you need to change the bloody red its too bright, doesnt look bloody, there needs to be more brown and even black...and it needs to follow a stained looked(paint the bowels a bowel colour, then take very thinned layers of the redish brown mix and and slap it around) brighten and dark said colour for multiple layers of stainyness(you can try it on a different model first or even a plastic base)

next for the spines, mix some brown and purple into the beige for shading, because they are next to yellow and the green is purpleish(blue/green) it will work together better and wont stand out too much because the purple will blend it in with the other colours while the brown tones down the effect purple has

next i think for the maggot face, the white lips look...um...awkward, you need less black more grey its too bold otherwise

PS in case you might not understand what i mean by shading, i dont mean paint the crevasses and cracks, i mean shade an area with thinned paint, it helps create a nicer look if interested

and just some knowledge for ya

A glaze changes the colour from greeny yellow to bluey yellow(aka tints) so they affect transitions, and are used for adding nuances

A wash changes a colour bright to dark, so its used for shading and adding depth

both are thinned transparent paint, just used in different ways

hope this helps, I want you to win after all!


Starks

N810
06-09-2007, 22:00
It keeps looking better and better.

fleshcross
06-09-2007, 23:40
You don't need 6 more painted armies, you should have scrapped the dragon and doubled your Skaven army!

Vattendroppe
07-09-2007, 05:31
You don't need 6 more painted armies, you should have scrapped the dragon and doubled your Skaven army!

*stab, rip, stabby-stab*

Never mind him... :p

pox
07-09-2007, 06:02
you just wait until the new skaven book. no more 0-1 on stormvermin, and I'm sure a plastic boxed set for em' to boot (along with new clan rats, no more pancake feet). I will have 3,000 in just clan mors, I can not wait. I have the base mostly finished, but alas, its past my bedtime, pics will have too wait.

The Dude
07-09-2007, 06:32
I have the base mostly finished, but alas, its past my bedtime, pics will have too wait.

Ooh, you dirty tease ;):p

speedygogo
07-09-2007, 22:49
I am thinking that if you don't win a golden daemon when you enter the dragon it would be a travesty. It looks awesome!

pox
08-09-2007, 04:20
On with the show! here's the base. its done, but I may add some glowing green runes, and may fill in the giant chaos symbol with metal. the arm is not done yet, just got its base coat on.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/base_002.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/base_003.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/base_004.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/base_001.jpg

well, one thing about posting pics, I get too see a totally different perspective on the dragon. looks like my trophy piles look a like a b-movie set, I'll try to make it look a bit better.

The Dude
08-09-2007, 11:08
The trophies need dirtying up. These are one thing that can stand to "blend in" a little. I'm worried about the red vine thing. What is it? It may be better off a slightly more muted colour.

Endemion
08-09-2007, 12:18
Stunning base. I think the red looks great at the moment, but will it clash with the rest of the dragon?

Braad
09-09-2007, 00:15
If this is done, I'll build a temple so we can worship you...

Inquisitor Konig
09-09-2007, 00:58
Personaly I like the skull with the bleeding eyes.
Please Please Please keep it up!

pox
09-09-2007, 04:28
touched the base up a bit. I'm not sure what the red things are supposed to be, I just painted them like veins. just needed a bit of texture mostly. I highlighted the blue a bit, works for me. I dimmed the blood just a hair, and decided to add moss everywhere, mostly hiding little painting mistakes. the base is obscured quite a bit by the completed model, the colors on it should contrast nicely with the dragon. (at least I hope so, we shall see when I mount it.) I just don't want to spend an ocean of time on the base, and I am pretty happy with the results.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/underbase_002.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/underbase_001.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/underbase_003.jpg

I'm gonna have a problem with re-assembly. I used the smallest cutter when I took him apart, but for the larger pieces I had to go a bit bigger. the ankles are missing about an eighth of an inch, so its gonna be quite a challenge to put humpty dumpty back together. I need to drill pin holes, and then cut the brass tubing to the exact hight I need, epoxie in place, then fill with clay and sculpt on detail. the job would not have been as bad if the joints were flush, but if wishes were fishes we would all have a fry.
The point of all that is I don't want to re-assemble till its completely painted. the parts of my brain that controls sculpting are quite different then the ones that control painting, and switching between them is arduous. its just easier for me to stay in one gear, rather then keep switching back and forth. (oddly enough, its how I do an army. I assemble the whole thing, then paint the whole thing.) so at any rate, what part do you wanna see next? I cheated and have been working a bit on the western head. (pics sometime next week.) after the western head, your options are:
1. boring maggot tail.
2. lamprey head.
3. awesome claw.
4. awesome tail.
5. fish-in-a-wing
6.boring wing.

I still have the arm on the base to finish, and the western head, so you have about a week to tell me what to finish next. also, this is gonna be my last update for a few days, I got some RL stuff to do.

sanctusmortis
09-09-2007, 13:24
Hmmm... Awesome claw please!

feeder
10-09-2007, 00:35
Man, this is looking good. So glad you are healthy and back on track, pox.

I'll second the "awesome claw" vote.

The Dude
10-09-2007, 01:59
touched the base up a bit. I'm not sure what the red things are supposed to be, I just painted them like veins. just needed a bit of texture mostly. I highlighted the blue a bit, works for me. I dimmed the blood just a hair, and decided to add moss everywhere, mostly hiding little painting mistakes. the base is obscured quite a bit by the completed model, the colors on it should contrast nicely with the dragon. (at least I hope so, we shall see when I mount it.) I just don't want to spend an ocean of time on the base, and I am pretty happy with the results.

All good. The "veins" could possibly look a wee bit better if you did a subtle blend at the ends, like the veins were penetrating the rock somehow. That's probably a bit pedantic though.

I love the moss, it really helps to drop the trophy piles into the background.

Just to be different, I will vote for the "boring wing", because I'd like to see all the webbing and such without all the fishy details.

Vattendroppe
10-09-2007, 06:13
I'll call my vote for the boring wing, then the other wing. To keep balance.

Dragon of the Pants
10-09-2007, 13:02
Awesome claw sounds good to me.

Master Bait
13-09-2007, 04:34
as per the dude's comments i agree the veins look kinda weird and out of place by contrasting far too much with the cold greys of the stone. my first thought would be to make the rock a dark red to show it being tainted by the veins, but then it might blend into the rest of the chaos dragon. my other suggestion is to make the veins the same hue as the rock, and i think that'd be a nice subtle contrast overall to the dragon perching on it.

i will say i have issue with the blue of the maggot though - a warm yellow-sickly colour wouldn't clash with the other earthy colours on the dragon. still, your choice.

overall i wish there's was some way possible for me to have sex with that thing. its bloody gorgeous dude

sanctusmortis
13-09-2007, 09:19
On the veins thing - maybe a few coats of ink to darken it up? I think the issue people have is the brightness...

Soahc
13-09-2007, 10:07
Love the dragon!!!!!
OMG u rock!!!!:D

AinuLainour
13-09-2007, 22:17
On the veins thing - maybe a few coats of ink to darken it up? I think the issue people have is the brightness...

If this is intended for competition, then inks would be terrible... all with WAAY too much gloss.


@pox - Just wondering if you were listening to starks, he's got some great advice in those essay-ish posts of his!

Starks333
13-09-2007, 22:38
the base needs to endure a lot of colouring, its going to stand out as its bright grey/white with bright red next to a brown skinned dragon

you dont want your base to stand out, you want it to unify your model

so take some colours from your model, mix them together and apply as washes to areas....like browns, blue browns, or greens, or purples, yellows etc

theres a link to a model im working on: Nurgle Dread (http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.php?showtopic=117726&st=15&start=15) My palette contains 14 or 15 different colours for the dreadnought alone, take a look to see how they all work together....im using colour to create an effect and highlights to bring you to the focus(when its done), you should be using colour to create an effect while creating a focus, highlights arent as important because its such a big model and you arent doing any lighting effects

the colour helps liven up the model and make sure the detail stays, but the fact im using less saturated colours means you arent losing focus on say his knees or his toes, but instead where i want you to(his head)...its the main reaosni have to shade and weather the green pipe more

mixing in some colour will liven up the base and tone it down

for the red, add some green or brown to your red, it will take away that super brightness and let it sink in more so its not a focus

as Ainu said, avoid inks, they look horrible and ruin your depth(shadows arent suppose to shine), especially on metallics

you really need to desaturate your colours more(mix in greys or brown, black or white or a complimentary colour), it will take away the over the top ness of some areas, and open you to a wider range of colour, because it seems like you are kinda struggling to find colours for everything(i know i would theres a lot to this model!)


hopefully this helps out a bit


Starks

pox
14-09-2007, 01:36
my skill has come as far as its gonna on this project, methinks. I have said already, I'm no longer painting it for competition, I just want to finish it at my current skill level. this IS the best I can paint, its not like I spent six months sculpting it, then decided to scrimp on the paint job. I would rather it be done and move on, then trying to make it perfect, or better then I can currently do.

every mini I have made, I thought it was the best. and every time I make a new one, its better then the last. same with the paint jobs. I can always hack it apart later, and apply new skill to it later. ( I will have a thread on doing just that with an old bloodthirster, and my kult of speed army for 40k.)

I have painted every bit of the dragon at least twice, and at this point in the game, I am going with what I know, rather then what I should know. thanks again for everyone's support.

Zanusiekk
14-09-2007, 06:49
I think it will still look very good when done, the sculpt is amazing, and that paintjob, whilst it might not be golden daemon standard, certainly brings out the fine points in a good way, so it is not like you are ruining your sculpt or anything... You really should be proud of yourself for what you have accomplished, everything is a learning experience!

tinfoil
14-09-2007, 12:29
In general, I think Starks's advice is sound.
But...
This particular model is so big and so varied and so, well, chaotic, that I'm not sure intensifying focus is even possible. In any event, what I like about Pox's approach to painting is that it highlights and distinguishes the many dimensions/effects/aspects of the model. It helps pick out individual elements -- creating an overall affect akin to mapping the piece. One really sees and appreciates the scales, the maggot, the fins, the horns, the teeth.....

Normally I'd suggest a more unified pallet, but in this particular case, I like the vividness of scheme and the way it articulates or highlights the underlying form.

The Dude
14-09-2007, 13:53
The base in itself is sort of cool being a focus anyway, as it's the army herdstone too, isn't it?

fleshcross
14-09-2007, 16:44
Wow, you're going to redo the Kult of Speed? I can't wait to see it! You should resculpt your Tyranids, too, I'd love to see what you could do now.

pox
14-09-2007, 21:27
yeah, the base is my army's herdstone. the fluff I have floating around is the herdstone is a monolith erected when my main wargor ascended to daemonhood. one of the last mini's I'll do for my beasts of chaos is my beastman daeemon prince.
one thing to keep in mind when thinking about perspective and attention focus, is the size of the model. its bigger then a warlord titan. its wingspan is soo large, models can be under the canopy of them, but not have to test for fear. the trick I used to keep it in perspective, and not seem like a larger scale mini, is the amount of detail. and if that detail is going to be noticed, I need to draw attention to it. at any rate, its been quite the challenge to get it painted. I am finishing the western head tonight, and the base by the weekend. so far, the votes are two for the boring wing, and three for the awesome claw. claw has the lead, so speak up if you wanna see something else get painted first.

oh, and fleshcross, I really, really, really wanna do a godzilla tyranid army. six carnifexs and two hive tyrants. add lictors, ravenors, stealers. serve opponent. but thats aways away, after the dragon I'm knocking out 2-3 fantasy armys. this detail stuff is for the birds, I miss speed painting.

back to painting. I should have pics before bed tonight, in about six hours or so.

Braad
14-09-2007, 22:13
yeah, the base is my army's herdstone. the fluff I have floating around is the herdstone is a monolith erected when my main wargor ascended to daemonhood.

And now your dragon is flying around with the herstone, since everywhere he is going, the stone will follow...

But yikes, I can't wait to see this finished.
And don't be bothered by people telling you is must be better then what you can manage. It looks fantastic!

pox
15-09-2007, 04:47
ok, got the head mostly done. I still need to do his huge maggot wound, and the swords in him are just base coated, I wanted to see how they would roughly look. I will go back and make each weapon unique in some fashion.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/headneardone_002.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/headneardone_001.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/headneardone_003.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/headneardone_004.jpg

I can see looking at the pics I need a little cleaning up here and there, mostly around the great horns.
I should be able to finish the arm around the base tomorrow. after that is super claw by one vote, so I'll start thinking about that. it should be one of the more challenging pieces to finish.

Khorghan
15-09-2007, 05:32
That is one fine dragon

Chi
15-09-2007, 07:38
I can see looking at the pics I need a little cleaning up here and there, mostly around the great horns.
I should be able to finish the arm around the base tomorrow. after that is super claw by one vote, so I'll start thinking about that. it should be one of the more challenging pieces to finish.

The Dragon is ok. Try adding some blood to your browns, it really brings out the warm colors really well. Especially when coupled with natural light. That technique would have won me the Golden Daemon back in '89, but GW said I didn't use "pure" GW products on my mini... on account of the blood of course. So now I just lurk Warseer all day critiquing other people's work and collecting social security checks.

If you want any more tips just let me know. I don't accept money, just some patronizing.

The Dude
15-09-2007, 08:25
I would suggest a slight darkening of the curly horns.

Although it's hard to tell as a seperatre piece, it's just looking a bit too overwhelmed with white at the moment.

pox
15-09-2007, 13:22
yeah, the horns are a mess, I'm gonna have another crack at em' before I mount the head. I can say they look a ton better in real life, the damn thing has just never photographed well. hard to get good angles that show off the overall head structure.

pox
16-09-2007, 01:27
the pics of the head keep bugging me, so I got more. I forgot to get some black background shots on a mostly white model. so here's two slightly better pics, along with a fun scale shot.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/betterheadshot_003.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/betterheadshot_002.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/betterheadshot_001.jpg

one of my fine chariots. protip: don't paint three in one day if you want them to look good closer then four feet. :)
oh and chi, I have seen a ton of minis for GD 89' (I started playing in 92'), and you would have won if you put blood in them. this was back when GW was just a group of weirdo metal-heads, and if mixing blood into the paint isn't metal, I don't know what is. you also could win for a humorous entry, but those are very rare now.

The Dude
16-09-2007, 01:45
The black background makes a huge difference. Still heavily white, but I suspect that will be less of an issue when assembled.

pox
16-09-2007, 02:08
thats what I'm hoping for. the small curved horns have a bit more brown, and better transitions then the big ones. I'm gonna re-do them, and add something to the side horns. but I like the scales, they look mighty fine.

Catferret
16-09-2007, 03:22
I hadn't realised just how big this beast was...

Um, wow. Yeah.

Nice work Pox.

I like the colour of the horns btw. Don't think they are too white.

soultaker87
16-09-2007, 04:44
god can't wait to see this guy done, keep up the damn good work pox

Vattendroppe
16-09-2007, 08:43
Just wanted to say that IMO the painting don't have to be better. Although I'm sure you can paint it better if you just gave a damn I also know what it feels like to be semi-tired of a project. And with that in mind it's marvellous that you still do the best you can at the moment.

Also, the best you can do at the moment is quite much better than many of us here can paint!

pox
16-09-2007, 13:18
thanks, I appreciate that.

Grenswick
16-09-2007, 20:53
I think it is very easy to forget the scale of this model. The head being the size of the chariot and wingspan extending outside terror range is hilarious. Simply a stunning project, I am honored to have held this beast in my grasp, and i will be honored to have my marauders crushed beneath it's massive jaws and swallowed by it's creepy heads!

sanctusmortis
16-09-2007, 22:54
Pox, you know you the man. Have confidence, take the time needed, and it won't go wrong. It's already proving that.

See that? Motivational speaker for hire, guys!

JT-Y
16-09-2007, 23:23
The Dragon is ok. Try adding some blood to your browns, it really brings out the warm colors really well. Especially when coupled with natural light. That technique would have won me the Golden Daemon back in '89, but GW said I didn't use "pure" GW products on my mini... on account of the blood of course. So now I just lurk Warseer all day critiquing other people's work and collecting social security checks.

If you want any more tips just let me know. I don't accept money, just some patronizing.

*Nearly dies laughing*

Thank you Chi, made me laugh till I nearly puked :D



Anyway, and if I can compose myself...

Dragon looks good Pox.
Part of me wants to suggest that you try softening some of the shades and hilights, when I look at the individual parts, but another part knows that, due to the complexity of the entire sculpt and trying to visualise the finished thing, it would look washed out...

No, it's nice as it is. The paint you have applied works and makes the tremendous detail pop.
I'd hate to paint it and admire your tenacity and conviction.

Keep it up because I'm looking forward to seeing it all done (from someone who's won Demons with Foundry paints and no bodily fluids ;) ).

The Dude
16-09-2007, 23:49
Thank you Chi, made me laugh till I nearly puked :D


Oh, you should have puked. Then you could have mixed it with your greens when painting a Nurgle army :rolleyes:

pox
20-09-2007, 04:49
time to get this train wreck re-railed. (before more unseemly paint-mix mediums are suggested.) heres the base done, except for the feet.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/base_001-1.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/base_002-1.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/base_003-1.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/base_004-1.jpg

the major change is the "veins" on the base. I decided after seeing them with the done texture of the arm, that they were a distraction. my first thought was to re-paint them black, but I decided it would be faster and look just as good to simply remove the veins. I kept the ghost of them around, leaving the areas they were at blackened. lastly, I added more of the moss to fill in the blanks.

I'm quite pleased with the claw texture of the arm, thats gonna be the wing-tip claws. I'll experiment on the main body to make sure they are gonna work like that. Its the same method as doing the horns/scales, just with grays.

I've been staring at the head a bit, and after some advise from a friend, I'm gonna re-do the big horns. (both sets.) I'm just gonna bring them more in line with the bone color, he pointed out they don't need to be a different texture, and are drawing the eye away from detail, rather then into it.

all thats gonna wait though. I want to do something fun for a bit, so it's gonna be super claw up next. I have games Thursday and Friday, so no big update until the weekend.
Its hard to pace myself with the finish line so close.

The Dude
20-09-2007, 05:04
the major change is the "veins" on the base. I decided after seeing them with the done texture of the arm, that they were a distraction. my first thought was to re-paint them black, but I decided it would be faster and look just as good to simply remove the veins. I kept the ghost of them around, leaving the areas they were at blackened. lastly, I added more of the moss to fill in the blanks.

Much better. I like that you kept a vestige of them there, but you are right, there were a bit distracting. If it were mine, I'd but a full stop on it ;).


Its hard to pace myself with the finish line so close.

Oh, I know THAT feeling. Fight it, boy. Fight it!

Master Bait
21-09-2007, 04:23
yeah dude that looks dope

bof bof

pox
23-09-2007, 02:39
I got the super-claw finished. I have always had problems photographing the claw, so this is gonna be in two posts. the claw part is just massive compared to the rest of the hand, and the fingers are all splayed out in wonky directions. it looks good in person, but not so good in pictures. its also a lot easy to see the detail when its mounted, due to the angle its posed in.

here's right and left shots.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/IMG_0266.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/IMG_0267.jpg

and top and bottom shots. (special thanks to a lone dwarf ranger for supplying much needed support for the picture, his mates are in the next update.)
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/IMG_0270.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/IMG_0269.jpg

pox
23-09-2007, 02:43
here's the next pic, just a different angle I liked.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/IMG_0268.jpg

and lastly, another scale shot. here's the claw next to a unit of 14 rangers.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/IMG_0271.jpg

I'm doing the cool tail next, its been scaring me, and is the largest, most time consuming piece on the dragon. (currently.)

after that, I got boring wing, fish-in-a-wing, the lamprey head, and maggot tail. cast yer votes if your so inclined.

fleshcross
23-09-2007, 04:04
Oh man, that claw ROCKS pal. Seriously, I love it.

Jonke
23-09-2007, 04:42
The grey/metal on the edges of the claws are really cool. As is the rest of the dragon.

pox
23-09-2007, 04:42
hey fleshcross, your the 400th poster in this thread! you win nothing! loser!
seriously, thanks. I finished about half the base coat on the tail, and thought I would post a fun scale shot. the tail goes out the back on the right, goes under the dragon on the left, and fills the void under his left wing. a lot of its design was the most fun, and gives the cthulu look to the dragon from behind.

I have been working on assembling my dwarfs during drying times while painting the dragon. its not much at once, but I have assembled 100 dwarfs so far.
here is a picture of the dragon tail behind 25 rangers, 25 warriors, 25 longbeards, and 25 primed hammerers.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/tailscale.jpg

in the immortal words of oliver, the mad scientist from the comic strip bloom county, "now THAT'S a tail!

N810
23-09-2007, 05:23
Woah that claw is frikin Awsome!

Grenswick
23-09-2007, 06:26
Since when do you play Dwarves of all races?!

fleshcross
23-09-2007, 06:36
Hey Pox, you know what kind of people play Dwarves. Do you really want to catch what they have?

I never win anything. However, I do have 75% of your dream D&D group living up here with me, so hah.

tinfoil
23-09-2007, 13:35
Love the claw -- particularly the eye.

Merceus
23-09-2007, 14:00
*places finger tips together for some random reason* oooh, shiny... Looks so awesome!!! No! More then awesome!! *dies*

pox
23-09-2007, 23:31
Since when do you play Dwarves of all races?!

there gonna be for next years fantasy log, "nine armys in twelve months."
tired of this high-class stuff, gonna do some speed painting.

ReclecteR
24-09-2007, 02:14
It's looking really sweet, keep it up man. I say go for the fish in a wing next. Something interesting to do, but after you do that you still have other cool stuff to do, so you wont get bored.

how are you going to reattach everything? Wont there be gaps in the detail?And good job with the dwarvs :D

RR

pox
24-09-2007, 05:27
when I cut it apart, I used a small disk cutter when I could, but most of the cuts had to be done with 1/8th inch heavy wheel. so the theory is to set pins in every joint, leaving the right sized gap, and then re-sculpt. to insure the structure, I want to use the largest gauge brass I can for each joint, then set with high grade two- part epoxy.

the good news is, my local shop owner, travis, is a pinning expert. this guy could build a car with just brass pins and rare earth magnets. he is gonna help me with the final settings.

BarreBobby
24-09-2007, 14:09
AAAAAAKKKKKK!

Why are you so gooooood!

:cries:

Seconded:cries:

Vattendroppe
24-09-2007, 15:53
The only thing I'm confused about is where you do get all time from? You have a VIP 42 hours/daycycle or what? :p

pox
24-09-2007, 20:34
right now, I'm working 50-60 hours a week to pay for my car accident. (new car+medical bills.) I play warhammer one day a week, and socialize one day a week. other then that, I stay at home and paint. its the only thing keeping me sane right now.

its kind of crazy, but I can go to work at six in the morning, work until 2 or 3 in the afternoon, then come home and paint until 10 at night. I do that four days a week, and on my one day off I start painting at 7 in the morning, and with the exception of food breaks, I paint until ten at night. (I also open our local game store and work for a few hours on my day off, but I paint while working.) I usually do this for 3-4 weeks in a row, then take a week or two off.

you know, reading it like that now, I may have a painting addiction.

Anardakil
24-09-2007, 20:58
... yeaaaah I think you do. I could use a painting addiction for a while :S

Vattendroppe
25-09-2007, 07:00
...Maaayyyybe you should see someone about that...

:p

pox
26-09-2007, 23:32
just a small picture-less update. I got invited to an art showing at the end of October, and have nothing new for it.
I'm gonna take a month long break from the dragon to do some scary art work, paint the battle of mcragge box set for my local shop, and bang out sixty alpha legion marines for some cold hard cash.
I may have small updates here and there, but I'm planning on finishing it in November.

Inquisitor Konig
27-09-2007, 05:03
boooo! just kidding. I have been glued to this forum for a long time but I am very interested in seeing some of your other work. Any chance that we might see some pictures of those?

pox
27-09-2007, 05:34
sure, I don't mind throwing up other art pictures, as long as no one minds the derail. I'll probably do it towards the end of the month, so I can put up strange stuff, then follow it with a dragon up-date.

Braad
27-09-2007, 08:19
I'll just go in cryo-stasis for a month, that'll keep me alive...

Vattendroppe
27-09-2007, 13:49
If anyone minds the derail they're not forced to watch this thread -.-

I say throw up other art pictures, we'll have something to do while we wait :)

(Also since this thread is almost the only thing that keeps me here on warseer)

unwanted
27-09-2007, 20:23
Damn, still can't get over the sheer awesomeness that this dragon brings to Warseer.

Still a good job!

pox
28-09-2007, 04:49
so, it seems I spoke too soon. I have pictures from a few days ago of the tail, and will have more on Sunday. I am working at the video store the whole weekend, and can paint while I work. In addition to that, I forgot I work at my local gaming store on Tuesdays, so I will have updates every Tuesday or Wednesday for October. the pacing will just be a tad slower, with only six hours or so a week, till November.

to spice things up, I'll go ahead and post pics of the other art stuff I'm doing when I have updates for the dragon, unless popular opinion doesn't want to see it. it will always be in tandem, so if there's an update, it will be primarily for the dragon. on with the show!

the tail is kinda hard to see, I fiddled with the settings as much as I could, but there's just tentacles everywhere. here's a few shots.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dollandtail_001.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dollandtail_002.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dollandtail_003.jpg

this next pic is kind of a perspective shot, the whole tail was designed to be seen from the front. the various tentacles are in a spiral pattern, and it's a lot easier to see now that its painted.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dollandtail_004.jpg

I really wanted it to have an elder-god feel, I swear the entire dragon from the back is an homage to H.P. Lovecraft.

up next: crazy dolls for Halloween. (well, the start of one.)

pox
28-09-2007, 04:58
so the first bit o' non warhammer art up is the beginnings of a steam-punk fallen angel. all I have is the monocle finished. in keeping with all things steam-punk, bigger is better. it sticks out quite a bit, but her hair and jaunty cap make it a perfect fit. I had to remove them for the head bits, along with her fancy dress. the clay around the torso is the base for her wings, which are going to be made from steak knives.

the effect in her eye is hard to see in pictures, the eye is sunk down about half-way into her skull. there are just plastic pieces there, for later techno-add ons.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dollandtail_005.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dollandtail_006.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dollandtail_007.jpg

I'm really not sure if I'm off base posting non wargames related art, if A mod says to take them down, I have no problem with that. also, if the general public has no interest in seeing these updates, then let me know.

MF3000
28-09-2007, 05:40
That's another cool project!

How big will the final product be?

sj

Despoiler
28-09-2007, 08:45
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dollandtail_004.jpg

looking good, can't wait for the next update.



http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dollandtail_005.jpg


like it,
Its creepy and disturbing yet in a good way.

BattleofLund
29-09-2007, 08:22
Its creepy and disturbing yet in a good way.


I'm really not sure if I'm off base posting non wargames related art, if A mod says to take them down, I have no problem with that. also, if the general public has no interest in seeing these updates, then let me know.

I doubt I will convert my own Chaos Dragon any decade soon. It's not why I follow this (and other) threads - just seeing people being creative makes me more creative and motivated. Therefore, I think anything you think worthy of posting will be approved of by us (me). If that changes, we (I) will definitely let you know.

And yes, that doll IS creepy. Hope it will be even creepier when finished! Keep it up!

Morglum Necksnapper
29-09-2007, 18:34
I'm looking forward to see the finished dragon.

Vattendroppe
29-09-2007, 18:50
I'm looking forward to hear ppls reactions when looking at that doll! Gee's, it's creapy as hell!

Witchfire
29-09-2007, 21:31
steeeeaaaam puuuunnnk!

i wore my steampunk clothes to pantomime rehearsal on friday, went down a storm :D

Rowder
30-09-2007, 20:12
Damn his big :O

Isha
12-10-2007, 13:19
I just saw this thread and .... I just cannot believe what Mr. Pox did ... Just incredible ...

I actually stopped working for almost one hour to look at the pics. Urgencies can wait.

This is the moment when miniatures met ART.

pox
12-10-2007, 23:41
thanks a ton isha, that means a lot. sorry for no new updates, I'm throwing together 5,000 points of khorne armored assault for apoc, but I should get to the dragon by next week. the break has been good, I'm looking forward to working on it again, which is good. the only potential snarl is I might have to do make-up for another film in November. if I get the job, I will get enough cash to get out of debt completely, which means working my lazy 35 hours a week, instead of my 50-60 I'm doing right now. (which means more dragon-time.)

thanks for everyone's patience. the doll is done, I'll try and get pics soon.

BDJV
12-10-2007, 23:45
Wow, that's a fantastic looking Dragon you're gonna have! It is incredible indeed!

fleshcross
13-10-2007, 00:29
Khorne armored assault? Tell me more Lunchbox.

pox
13-10-2007, 01:39
70 berserkers, 8 possessed, kharne the betrayer and a khorne lord w/ daemon weapon in eight rhinos. daemonic host with greater daemon and 40 lesser daemons. 2 defilers, 2 CC dreadnoughts, 2 vindicators, (cannons of khorne) and 2 predator annihilators. 8 bikers with khorne icon.

16 vehicles in all, should be a blast on the battlefield.

fleshcross
13-10-2007, 06:48
Damn you snapdragon, damn you.

And here I was almost finished with my Heresy Era World Eaters Terminators (just need to line two more!), now you have to ruin everything. That's a lot of painting though, good thing you like punishment, eh? I can hardly wait to see pictures.

pox
22-10-2007, 04:06
In the chaos of October I have gotten a little bit further, thanks to some inspiring games at the shop. I really wanted to get my khorne army hammered out for Apocalypse, but in the end decided they can wait, not the dragon. Here's what I got so far.

up first, the tail with little spikes finished.
from below
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/wings_003.jpg
and above
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/wings_004.jpg

the little spikes are quite tedious, so I'm getting relief painting the wings. my plan is to get both wings and the tail done, switching between them as it gets too boring. (its working so far)

up next is the fish-in-a-wing. the teeth were just too crammed together to paint, so I had to cut his jaw off. aside from that distraction, the membrane parts are finished, aside from detailing out the small mouths and various wounds on it (haven't gotten around to fixing the claws yet, and ignore the gloss coat its just for protection right now.)
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/wings_002.jpg

last up is the boring wing, with about half the layering done for the leather wings.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/wings_001.jpg

I still have a little more craziness left for Halloween, but after that, I'm free to work on the dragon full time.

The Dude
22-10-2007, 04:13
I really wanted to get my khorne army hammered out for Apocalypse, but in the end decided they can wait, not the dragon.

I think you made the right choice :D


the little spikes are quite tedious, so I'm getting relief painting the wings. my plan is to get both wings and the tail done, switching between them as it gets too boring. (its working so far)

A good plan. I find breaking the monotony is the best way to keep a project on track, and whatever keeps you working is good with me, Pox ;)

The tail looks ace. The yellowy-brown ridges set it off perfectly.

Iíll be interested to see the wings when they are further progressed. At the moment theyíre looking a bit bland. Keep it up Pox.

Vattendroppe
22-10-2007, 05:15
<3

Think it's good if you celebrate halloween also, might be good for you to do something else than that dragon also :p

pox
30-10-2007, 16:39
here's the fish-in-a-wings lower jaw.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/fish_001.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/fish_002.jpg

and the upper jaw,
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/fish_003.jpg

finally, a shot of the fish itself, with barnacle shell done.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/fish_004.jpg

I'm painting the rest of the fish, then reattaching the jaw today. (hopefully.)

I just have one make-up job today, and three tomorrow. after that, its all dragon, all the time.

Vattendroppe
30-10-2007, 17:00
Nice shots :) Looking very good! Very good indeed! Maybe just that the fishteeth are a bit to bright, but that's a matter of taste i guess.

N810
30-10-2007, 17:19
Your horn/teeth are really looking better.
This dragon is gonna be awesome.

teefkrakka
30-10-2007, 18:22
Just found this,and all i can say is Wow!Never have painted anything that scale,so i salute you.From your pictures i wouldnt know where to start with all the textures.Ill be waiting patiently to see the final outcome,and im sure it will be great.

beefpizza
30-10-2007, 19:11
Its coming along really nicely. All I can say is don't give up and keep plugging away at it!

Vattendroppe
30-10-2007, 19:41
Just found this,and all i can say is Wow!Never have painted anything that scale,so i salute you.From your pictures i wouldnt know where to start with all the textures.Ill be waiting patiently to see the final outcome,and im sure it will be great.

And I hope that you're awair of the fact that he sculpted it to? :eek::eek:

The Dude
30-10-2007, 22:30
So many teefs. My eyes are sore just thinking about painting them...

Asuril
30-10-2007, 23:35
Looking fantastic!

I don't think you could pour more Chaos into that dragon. It's so perfect!

teefkrakka
31-10-2007, 19:50
No i didnt realize that he sculpted this.Amazing work,hope to be able to slulpt like this someday.Great work.

N810
31-10-2007, 20:36
heres the finished sculpt.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/finished4.jpg
you should check out his original sculpt log

teefkrakka
01-11-2007, 16:16
Wow,that would take me atleast a year to paint.Thats why i love visiting this forum.To see amazing stuff like this.

Nostro
01-11-2007, 17:44
What I love from this work is that I keep discovering new details from what unpainted seemed a white see of teeth.

I remember the first time I saws the WIP sculpt, there was only the body and neck mock-ups, I thought "Meh, looks a bit snakey and dodgy. Exposed inners only do not make for a nice Chaos dragon". How wrong have my first impressions been proven!

I really like the fact that it's not just a giant dragon with rotting flesh, it's so much more. It's telling a story. There is a maggot here, a fin there, a fish in a wing over there, and so on. It's full of little details that make the thing unique and amazing.

Props, Mr. Pox.

Khorghan
01-11-2007, 19:10
Im impressed, this is a monster of a project and your bringing it along very nicely, great painting too

pox
02-11-2007, 03:59
Thanks everyone for your kind words, it really helps when your in the tedious parts. as to the number of teeth, I'm actually more scared of the lamprey mouth. there's more, they're smaller, and they need a lot more detail. (being in the front, and with nothing obscuring them. bleh!)

anyhow, on with the show! I got me a fish finished.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/fishdone_001.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/fishdone_003.jpg]
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/fishdone_002.jpg]
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/fishdone_004.jpg

if it seems a bit colorful, just remember its gonna match the tail, and its just a splash of color when the whole thing is assembled. I know it looks a bit weird, but its exactly how I envisioned it. (except maybe better eyes, but the paint started to add texture, so I called it good.) I figure you don't normally have a fish in a wing, so why not make it colorful.

up next, I'm gonna finish the claws on the wing, re-attach the fish jaw, and paint the bottom of the jaw.

I had a good Halloween, with lots of good gory make-up for friends, but now its crunch time on the dragon.

The Dude
02-11-2007, 04:15
Chaaa-hoice!!!

Looking brilliant Pox. I don't think it looks odd at all. I love the visual connection to the western head too. This whole thing just has layers and layers of detail.

Top job!

Khorghan
02-11-2007, 05:41
The fish turned out nicely, it doesent look out of place at all on such a crazy mini

fleshcross
02-11-2007, 06:45
Damn slugger, that's churning out nicely!

Hey, check out my Chaos stuff, tell me what you think Lunchbox.

Vattendroppe
02-11-2007, 07:32
AFAIK it's not very common with fish in wings, no. Except for flying fishes, but that's more fishes with wings than wish in wing I s'ppose... :p

Max1mum
02-11-2007, 08:28
this has to be the first thread with so many pages that i have gone through from start to finish....( i might have skipped some of blind praises, but i think i got them all )

Now if anybody can tell me where the que is for giving out praises, ill get in the back of the line with enough food to last me a day or 3.

Allright your both a inspirational source and a nightmare, i mean after seeing al that...why bother. Why bother with a log or painting at all i might just put a black primer on it and be done with it ;-). Aftera all ill never be able to match up to that o_O !

But after seeing all those tips people posted i'm going to have to go for a log my self, hoping its going to generate so much support to help develop my Painting skills, where can i sign up for Team warseer ?

Merceus
02-11-2007, 16:05
Im not easy to scare, but that fish (just the fish) is kinda creeping me out...

*looks again*

That second-to-last pic is just disturbing! Well done :evilgrin:

Inquisitor Konig
02-11-2007, 16:22
I can see a little texure on one of those eyes... who cares though I love the fish... I was going to say that the wing is a little bland compared to the rest of the Dragon but that fish is perfect!

pox
07-11-2007, 05:15
yeah, the texture on the eyes is why they're a bit bland. it was hard to add a lot of layers without adding texture. I plan on the fish parts being high-gloss, I think that will go a ways to fixing the problem. on with the pictures!

I got the fish wing completely done. the only thing that might change is the red on the top of the fish, (its a bit bright) but I'm gonna wait until its on the dragon before making that call. I re-did the claws, using the same techniques I used on the left hand, which really worked on the larger claws. there is gray on the bottom of the big claws, its just hard to see. I love the two-tone claws, they look like sharks teeth. I also painted the little mouths in the wing membranes, and highlighted the various cuts in his wings.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/donewing_004.jpg

I also re-attached his jaw. its hard to get good pics of it, the whole mouth curves along the wing. after the flesh is painted on it, I'll try and get it posed better by setting it on something. it looks fine on the dragon, just weird to get good pics of it upside down.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/donewing_001.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/donewing_002.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/donewing_003.jpg

I also got the maggot tail half way done, I should have pics in the next few days. it seems I left all the tiny detail for last, so I'm just trudging through claws and spikes for the next few days. (still got the second half of the tail to finish, bleh.)

however, after all the tedium is done, I get to paint the lamprey head. I'm using it as a reward, cause after that, all I have to do is assemble the giant monstrosity.

The Dude
07-11-2007, 05:24
Man, I'm getting really ******** excited to see this baby done :D:D:D

AdamAtCollege
07-11-2007, 06:35
Man, I'm getting really ******** excited to see this baby done :D:D:D

Ditto x 1000

Mighty Chicken
07-11-2007, 11:21
I’ve been following the construction and painting of this incarnation of awesomeness with great delight and must say that if there ever was a model of a dragon that truly captures the sheer and absolute terror one of those creatures would elicit, it has to be this.

Please keep up the good work!

By the way: I reckon the red on the fish looks perfect for some recent mutation that sort of didn’t really work out (quite appropriate for chaos) where you can still see the raw muscle tissue.

Grenswick
07-11-2007, 13:40
Your gonna be sorry when you finish this thing and it gets up and kills everything that you love...it's like, Frankensteins monster or something.

Starks333
07-11-2007, 14:47
yeah, the texture on the eyes is why they're a bit bland. it was hard to add a lot of layers without adding texture. I plan on the fish parts being high-gloss, I think that will go a ways to fixing the problem. on with the pictures!


if by adding texture you mean from the paint, thats simply because your paint isnt thin enough when applying, or it has dried up in your brush because you havent applied it quickly enough

i wont comment on any colours however as you already know they do not suit my tastes visually

good to see you back on task ;)


Starks

truthsayer
07-11-2007, 15:09
brilliant work mate, any chance you can put together what you have done so far and take a pic or two.. its just that i would like to see just how far you have managed to get painting wise on the grand scale.

The Dude
07-11-2007, 21:49
brilliant work mate, any chance you can put together what you have done so far and take a pic or two.. its just that i would like to see just how far you have managed to get painting wise on the grand scale.

No, don't!

Let us wait in agony... :D

Nostro
07-11-2007, 22:43
No, don't!

Let us wait in agony... :D

Seconded. It's ok when it's really WIP, so that we have a good view of the advancement, but now it's too close to the end it'll spoil the surprise :)

truthsayer
08-11-2007, 10:22
ha ha you guys!

just pm me a pic of the modtly done dragon then pox.

I wont show it or post it anywhere else i promise.

leeoaks
08-11-2007, 23:14
i would hate to meet your friend on the battlefield i would shake you hand and concede! alll hail the mighty chaos dragon!!!!

Rikka Rakka
09-11-2007, 23:47
This has been one of the most amazing projects to watch from start to finish. In terms of imagination, painting skill, sculpting skill and sheer execution its been so inspiring.

Kyte
10-11-2007, 15:54
That wing reminds me of this image:
www.pacifier.com/~zen/creepy.jpg
WARNING: VERY DISTURBING!

Sleazy
10-11-2007, 16:11
i'm sure Pox had that as an avatar a while back

Nostro
10-11-2007, 17:58
He did.

Then, the avatar being too small to see what it was, somebody at some point asked for a close up, pox posted it (in the sculpting thread), two pages of "heeeeeew creepy" ensued, and pox took it down to protect the minds of innocent children. :p

pox
10-11-2007, 22:17
the water-dragon mouth is based off that picture, I hate lampreys. it just fit so perfectly, I wanted one "normal" head, and one I could go crazy with. I'm too old for drama on the internet, so yeah, I took it down. I should have known better in the first place, the picture bugged me for days. live and learn, I guess.

thanks again to everyone for their comments, it makes this last stretch easier. I'm painting all day today and tomorrow, should have an update sometime this weekend.

@truthsayer: I'll PM you a pic of all the parts in one place, but it wont look remotely assembled. I can't begin assembly till all the parts are painted, I need to make joints for everything first, then go piece by piece. its just gonna be easier to attach body to feet and base, then re-sculpt the seams, and finally paint the seams. I'll be posting pics of each stage, by then its back to the fun part, and should have a lot more energy to work on it.

at this point I just want it done, I have seven armies waiting for paint, including all the new high elf stuff. if I take a break though, it will be for months, and I don't want to do that with the end soooooo near. I figure two more weeks of painting, then assembly.

pox
12-11-2007, 04:45
I think it's happened at last, chaos has my soul. I have dreaded working on the dragon for a while now, but in the last few days, I have had such keen focus, this thing is getting DONE. just not sure if I'll owe tzeentch for the favor when I'm done.

first up, the maggot tail is done. it's a shade more blue then the bit in the dragon, but its gonna stay. (a whole lot easier to add more blue to the small bit, then re-paint this damn tail.)
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/donestuff_004.jpg

left wing is done.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/donestuff_002.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/donestuff_001.jpg

and lastly, a fun scale picture. It's the blister of korhil, whom I really, really want to paint right now. (actually, I would paint necrons at this point. ok not really, but I'm just sayin')
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/donestuff_003.jpg

I still have a full head of steam, I have decided to sprint towards the finish line. I plan on finishing all the little bits by tuesday, down to the smallest detail pre-assembly. after that, the only big part I have left is the lamprey head, which should be a bucket of fun to paint.

thanks again for everyones comments, it really does make painting this thing easier. (and makes a bad workday better, for some reason.)

The Dude
12-11-2007, 04:52
first up, the maggot tail is done. it's a shade more blue then the bit in the dragon, but its gonna stay. (a whole lot easier to add more blue to the small bit, then re-paint this damn tail.)

*annoying teeth sucking noise* Not too sure Iím, a big fan of the dark recesses in the maggot. I think Iíd rather have seen a mid tone as the darkest bit working up to almost white, but Iíll learn to live with it ;)

The wing is solid and I look forward to seeing it all stuck together.


I still have a full head of steam, I have decided to sprint towards the finish line. I plan on finishing all the little bits by tuesday, down to the smallest detail pre-assembly. after that, the only big part I have left is the lamprey head, which should be a bucket of fun to paint.

Iím excited about that Lamprey head. Go your hardest Pox!

tinfoil
12-11-2007, 13:26
Oh man, this is really exciting.
I've been following this log (and the preceding one about the sculpting) for many months. In fact, the first thing I check when I hit Warseer every day (after News and Rumors) is the Fantasy P&M blogs, hoping to see a Pox update. (Seriously. I don't even play fantasy!) The thought of actually being able to see the creature assembled and painted....

pox
12-11-2007, 23:42
this is a quick non-dragon picture update, but have no fear. I don't work tomorrow. I just went and got food, coffee, and five movies. I am not leaving my house for the rest of today, and all of Tuesday. I still plan to have everything but the lamprey head by tomorrow night.

on with the pictures! I started earlier in october with my steam-punk princess, and just got the finished model back from being on display.I thought I would post pics of it done. I wound up having too rush it, but I still like it. It's the only thing I can show from Halloween, the make-up I did isn't very kid friendly. for scale, those are steak knives at the ends of her wings.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/doll_002.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/doll_001.jpg

a lot of the fun with her was using lighting, her wings allow for some neat shadows.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/dollshadows.jpg

ok, so I will have an actual dragon update in five or six hours.

back to the front!

fleshcross
13-11-2007, 01:17
Damn, that looks awesome potpie! What was it for exactly again?

Oh, and answer your damn phone once in a while. I'll call tomorrow.

Braad
13-11-2007, 04:24
That's quite sick actually...

pox
13-11-2007, 05:46
alright, my progress for tonight. here's the left tail. the first pic is from the angle where it goes into the dragon, the second is a shot from the back. I had to cut the tail in half, it turned out to be too heavy to paint.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/leftail_001.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/leftail_002.jpg

so tomorrow should be at least a solid 14 hours of painting.

The doll was for an art project. downtown Chico was doing "artober", and my friend Manny owns a store downtown. he decided to turn his video store into a horror-themed art gallery for the month. mine was near the tamest, a lot of the paintings were pretty horrific. it was just fun to hang out with a bunch of artists for the official showing, I did gore make-up all night. a good Halloween, all-in-all.

and don't call me potpie.

Grenswick
14-11-2007, 02:07
Lookin sharp as always Mark, keep it up!

As a side note, remember when that beaver damned up the river a few weeks ago? Well, I was walking over a bridge at Chico state and some biology students were looking at dead fish down below, and one of them found a lamprey. Sounds like providence. The creatures of Chaos are flocking to the birth of the beast Mark, I suggest you bolt your doors closed and perhaps start carrying a crucifix or something.

pox
14-11-2007, 05:13
oh, I see, I summon my followers to me, and you want me to kill them?!? not gonna happen, push me far enough, and I'll sculpt a fishmen-beastmen army to go with my dragon.

on with the update!!! so painting for 14 hours strait didn't quite work out, I had to help a friend for two hours, so I only painted for 12 today. have no fear though, I get off of work tomorrow at 2:30, and I will be painting again until ten at night. I say it again, it has become my mantra. THIS THING IS GETTING DONE.

so tonights update will be accompanied by one of my mighty storm vermin for scale. I only got the tail finished today, it proved to just be too large to get done faster. the only thing it's missing is the eye, and two layers of paint on the ribbing. I am not discouraged, I hope to have all the small details done by tomorrow.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/IMG_0336.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/IMG_0335.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/IMG_0334.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/IMG_0338.jpg

I have all of tomorrow and Friday this week to work on it. I'm still really stoked about painting it again, so I'm just hoping this carries through till next week. what makes next week special, you say? well, Its thanksgiving, and the plans I had for the day fell through. I have decided to not get new ones, and instead, plan on spending the day painting. I get all day Monday and Thursday to paint next week, and thats just my days off.

The Dude
14-11-2007, 05:23
Looking good Pox. But... what eye?

pox
14-11-2007, 05:29
in the first picture, you can see a black spot in the tentacle on the right, that will be an eye.

and as a side note, I always look forward to your posts. I always update right around ten my time, then I get ready for bed, then check for your post. It's an easy compass for any glaring problems, haha.

Math Mathonwy
14-11-2007, 06:55
Whoah, didn't realize how massive the tail was! An awesome monster of a model. You have an interesting, very colourful way of painting - can't wait to see the whole model :)

Von Bismarck
14-11-2007, 08:43
this is truly amazing, im really looking forward to seeing this huge chaos beastie finished!

keep it up dude, this thread is becoming required reading ^^

The Dude
14-11-2007, 09:02
in the first picture, you can see a black spot in the tentacle on the right, that will be an eye.

Ahhh, I see it now...


and as a side note, I always look forward to your posts. I always update right around ten my time, then I get ready for bed, then check for your post. It's an easy compass for any glaring problems, haha.

Glad to be of service ;)

They usually go up around 4:30-5pm my time, so right before I knock off. A great way to end the day, I must say :D

Vattendroppe
14-11-2007, 19:47
The first thing that came in mind when I read about the eye was the stormvermins eye, talk about confusion! :O

But it's looking good, still voting that you take your time rather than rush through it :)

Witchfire
14-11-2007, 19:55
he steampunk princess looks sick, in two ways

pox
15-11-2007, 05:03
a quick non-pic update. I have finished all the little bits here and there that needed cleaning up. it was long and tedious, but nothing picture worthy. so all thats left to paint is the bottom jaw of the fish-in-a-wing, the last layer of gloss, and the lamprey head.

I am going to mix things up a bit from my original plan. the plan was to paint everything first, and then start the assembly. however, I have been working out plans for re-building it, and have come to the conclusion that I wont be able to do a lot at once. I need to pin each joint, then epoxy bond, then sculpt detail, then paint. I figure I can add a part a day, give or take. (pin,glue,sculpt, then the next day paint, followed by the next piece getting pined,glued,sculpted, etc.) and although these steps are gonna be difucult, they won't be particularly time consuming.

thus, my new plan is to start the assembly process, so I can paint the last bits in the down time. the wing and head that need painting are gonna be close to the last pieces added, so it works out perfectly.

I'm busy tomorrow night and Saturday, but I should have actual buiding up-dates on Friday and Sunday.

I could not have done the final tedious push without encouragement, thanks again to everyone.

one last thing, I need varnish brands available in the US. I'm gonna start a more detailed thread in the general section, but basically I need a good gloss varnish that won't yellow, and one that can be applied quite thick. I have had some success in the past using two part epoxy glue, (the same used for water effects and what not) and plan on using it for drool from the lamprey mouth. however, I would like a super bright, but not too thick, gloss or varnish for the blood tentacles. any advise would be appreciated.

The Dude
15-11-2007, 05:08
Guess who? Ha ha! :D

Sounds like a solid plan Pox. I look forward to seeing it all come together.

madd0ct0r
16-11-2007, 09:42
Have you considered rebuilding it in such a way you can take it apart for storage? Having said that, the bits you have it in look pretty fragile to start with.

ahh, screw it. I'll be glad to see it in one piece with paint.

sorry i can't help on the varnish front

pox
16-11-2007, 23:15
I got the varnish all figured out, the other post yielded what I needed. as too making it with removable parts, I thought about it, but it's just not feasible. it will be a delicate model, and I'll deal with it as a playing piece. the carrying case will be quite extraordinary, I figured out a pet carrier is gonna be my best option. I needed something sturdy enough to transport it to games day, not to mention the occasional battle. my plan is to just use it as a greater chaos dragon, using the forge world rules. that means it takes three rare choices, so it will only be brought out in 5,000+ point games.

my over-all philosophy on minis is they are playing pieces, and therefor break from time to time. I will be super careful until gamesday, and after that, as long as I don't drop it, I'm sure it will need repairs every third game or so. I have quite number pf gigantic pieces for 40k, including a mega-gargant thats made from a three gallon bucket, so I'm used to the occasional weapon/arm/foot replacement. (especially the damn gargant, its so big, its feet alone are the size of land raiders.)

The re-building has begun, I have all night to work on it, so I should have a picture update in about six hours.

pox
17-11-2007, 05:10
so I'm at the assembly stage, sort of. I'm bumping into paintmatching problems. I kept a very detailed journal of what paints I used where, but on a few of the pieces, I made a lot more changes, and never got around to making those changes everywhere. for example, I basically learned how to do the final scales on the western head, but never fixed the scales on the body, so I have to fix them now.
The other major problem is skill. I cut this apart five months ago, and through painting the different parts, I have become a much better painter. the difference in what I painted last week is noticeable from what I did two months ago. this is gonna result in little bits of the dragon here and there getting re-painted. I'm just gonna go piece by piece, and fix what I need as I go along. I'll also be fixing the final finish as I go, glossing up all the right parts and what-not. I'm hitting everything with matte before I attach it to the dragon.
here's the body mounted to the base. I'll Ive done it is glue it together, and paint the seams. this was the first big piece I did, so its gonna take the most touching up.
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/assembly_004.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/assembly_001.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/assembly_002.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n109/conversionman/assembly_003.jpg

After the paint and gloss are done, I'll be adding the tails next. I need to paint parts of the fish tail to match the body, and that needs to be attached before the maggot and crazy tail. I'm hoping to paint them at work tomorrow, so I can attach them on Sunday.

this is officially back to being fun, starting the assembly was the right thing to do. plus, I can't remember what it looks like, so its kinda neat to see it being re-built.

The Dude
17-11-2007, 05:20
:cries:

Why are you doing this to me???

pox
17-11-2007, 05:25
doing what to you? :)

Jonke
17-11-2007, 05:39
This thing is just so impressive I don't know what too say. I just wish I'd get to see it in real life. I really like the kind of old school bright paint scheme you've done on it.

I'm looking forward to follow your next project :D