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fazzgd
06-05-2007, 02:37
I read Dark angels Codex
I discovered an unsatisfactorily be part.
I hope come to change like this.

[HQ]
Master of the Deathwing
-Apothecary Upgrade cost down

Master of the Ravenwing
-Jetbike Weapon all Fire possibility.

Command Squads
-Company Champion Upgrade cost down

[Elites]
Deathwing terminator Squad
-Deathwing terminator Sergeant Combi-Weapon option get

Dreadnought
-Basic cost down
-Twin-linked Lascannon Upgrade cost down

Company Veterans Squad
-Second Razorback option get

Techmarines
-Return signum

Scout Squad
-Heavy bolter cost down
-missile launcher cost down

[Troops]
Tactical Squad
-Second Razorback option get

[Fast Attack]
Assault Squad
-Basic cost down

Ravenwing Support Squadron
-Basic cost down
-Assault Cannon Upgrade cost up

[Heavy support]
Devastator Squad
-Second Razorback option get

Predator
-Side sponsons with Lascannon Upgrade cost down

redbaron998
06-05-2007, 02:53
I would like to see Mind Worm become useful and for return of The Fear of the Darkness as an option

I agree with a lil of your "Fixs" but most are rubbish

Darkangeldentist
06-05-2007, 02:57
Were this a christmas list, you'd be getting coal.

HiveFleetEzekial
06-05-2007, 03:22
This isn't even close to a 'fix' list anyway. This is just extra stuff you'd 'like' to have. Maybe you should edit that "FIX" out. :\ Even then.. are you crazy!? Sure, let's suppose GW grant this 'wish'... *everyone* and their club is going to be complaining, to no end.. 'OMFG Dark Angels get TWO vehicles per squad.. that's not fair!!! WHY GW? WHY???? Dark Angels are cheese now!!" No Thanks. There were enough complaints, about our DeathWing being 'cheese' in the past, we don't need *more* of it.

fazzgd
06-05-2007, 04:45
*Second Razorback option
10man squad and 1Rhino or 10man Squad and 2Razorback

==Me==
06-05-2007, 06:00
Umm, most if not all of those "fixes" are unnecessary and are wishful thinking at best. Those costs are there for a reason, maybe you should try playing with the new list or using different setups.

Now, if I could change anything to the DA Codex, it would be this:
-Techmarine IC and Signum (no more scoring offsets the signum)
-Allow Scout Sgt a sniper rifle
-Either make Force Barrier work for all saves (maybe only once per turn, otherwise libbies get really mean) or replace it with FotD
-Lower cost of Pred sponson lascannons (50 would be fine)
-Drop Dread base cost by 10

Nothing really groundbreaking, just a few tweaks would make the list even better.

deathwing_marine
06-05-2007, 06:29
@HiveFleetEzekial: Don't think his first language is English, he's from Korea

I noticed the signum was gone too. But there are already plenty of threads full of Dark Angels gripes, I thought they'd started to stop...

Brother xavier
06-05-2007, 06:59
Are pred las sponsons over 50? what a rip off! I find it disappointing all the cost changes, I'm used to all the old costs. It seems that they are forcing players to choose specific options over others, eg more rhinos less Drop pods, trying to stop players using units or items by increasing their points, etc. I'm annoyed that the vehicles can't take all the options they were previously open to, the same with infantry etc. With these changes already made I'm worried that the Blood Angels will have many of the same drawbacks.

I feel a lot of armies will look the same as people avoid many of the units with points increases and no visible bonus's, and choose those units with points reductions.

deathwing_marine
06-05-2007, 08:09
Pred las sponsons are not over 50.
That would blow.

lord_blackfang
06-05-2007, 08:46
Pred sponsons are over 50 points. But what the whiners don't tell you is that you can actually field a basic Predator for under 80 pts.

Asq_Dak
06-05-2007, 10:15
Indeed, an annihilator with heavy bolter sponsons costs the same to space mariens AND dark angels. It's only when you go all out on lascannons that the price becomes extreme. (arguably more balanced because all lascannon costs went up in codex dark angels, but in my opinion it is not that great because it can't fire that well on the move... But maybe those weapons would want different targets anyway)

Onisuzume
06-05-2007, 10:32
I hope come to fix like this.
[HQ]
Master of the Deathwing
-Apothecary Upgrade cost down
The apothecary is already good for what it does.
It can easily make it's points cost back in a single round of enemy shooting.

Master of the Ravenwing
-Jetbike Weapon all Fire possibility.
Why? Be happy he has a storm bolter instead of a bolter, and he gets a heavy weapon ontop of it. That's good enough imo.

Command Squads
-Company Champion Upgrade cost down
To what? The 'nila marine equalevent?

[Elites]
Deathwing terminator Squad
-Deathwing terminator Sergeant Combi-Weapon option get
Why bother?

Dreadnought
-Basic cost down
-Twin-linked Lascannon Upgrade cost down
I'd rather ask for a basic cost drop and making the assault cannon an upgrade.

Company Veterans Squad
-Second Razorback option get
Techmarines
-Return signum
Scout Squad
-Heavy bolter cost down
-missile launcher cost down
[Troops]
Tactical Squad
-Second Razorback option get
[Fast Attack]
Assault Squad
-Basic cost down
Why the second razorback?
Signums are pretty useless afaik.
Scouts are, afaik, hardly ever fielded for their heavy weapons.
And why would the assault marines' cost be lowered? It's the same as in C:SM.

Ravenwing Support Squadron
-total option cost FIX
Don't really understand what you mean with this.

[Heavy support]
Devastator Squad
-Second Razorback option get

Predator
-Twin-linked Lascannon Upgrade cost down
-Side sponsons with Lascannon Upgrade cost down
Second razorback thingy again and cheaper las.
Who uses lascannon sponsons anyways? And it'd need to be stationary to use all of them.

I would like to see Mind Worm become useful and for return of The Fear of the Darkness as an option
I can agree on the Mind Worm, but they can scrap the FotD imo.

There were enough complaints, about our DeathWing being 'cheese' in the past, we don't need *more* of it.
There was? And was that pre or post 4th edition faq?

*Second Razorback option
10man squad and 1Rhino or 10man Squad and 2Razorback
Right, so why wouldn't it be a standard option for 'nilla marines then?
Oh yeah, that's right. The razorback sacrifices transport capacity for added firepower. Maybe that's why 'nilla marines can only take a razorback when they have 6 or less models in a squad.

Techmarine IC and Signum (no more scoring offsets the signum)
Techmarine would then allow another command squad.
And with the current way the techmarines are taken; it would effectively allow up to 8 command squads.

-Lower cost of Pred sponson lascannons (50 would be fine)
Personally I doubt the usefulness of the las sponsons. Though I guess it would sounds reasonable.

-Drop Dread base cost by 10
Drop the asscan instead I'd say. That should free up 20 points or so.

Acheron,Bringer of Terror
06-05-2007, 13:28
I read Dark angels Codex
I discovered an unsatisfactorily be part.
I hope come to fix like this.

[HQ]
Master of the Deathwing
-Apothecary Upgrade cost down

no point termie apothecary is good.

Master of the Ravenwing
-Jetbike Weapon all Fire possibility.

you're right. he should fire both weapons

Command Squads
-Company Champion Upgrade cost down

again reasonable.ATM it is no reason to take him

[Elites]
Deathwing terminator Squad
-Deathwing terminator Sergeant Combi-Weapon option get

no point

Dreadnought
-Basic cost down
-Twin-linked Lascannon Upgrade cost down

Definitely Yes. Basicaly in currrent DA and BA codices Dreads are seriously overpriced !!! 110 is maximal "worth it" price. Also Extra armour should cost less

Company Veterans Squad
-Second Razorback option get

Techmarines
-Return signum

i disagree

Scout Squad
-Heavy bolter cost down
-missile launcher cost down

You're right - why they must pay so much for heavy weapon

[Troops]
Tactical Squad
-Second Razorback option get

[Fast Attack]
Assault Squad
-Basic cost down


i'd rather say - reduce cost of plasma pistols, right now they are way overpriced

Ravenwing Support Squadron
-total option cost FIX

[Heavy support]
Devastator Squad
-Second Razorback option get

Predator
-Twin-linked Lascannon Upgrade cost down
-Side sponsons with Lascannon Upgrade cost down

With these 2 i disagree.

Slaaneshi Slave
06-05-2007, 13:37
What, pray-tell.. is with all the "..... get"?? (this isn't a net/L33Tspeek compatable forum.)

He is Korean. How good is your Korean? His English seems pretty decent, to me. After playing a Korean MMO for years (Lineage2), this is how most of them speak when writing English, I suppose it is a direct translation from their native tongue.

fazzgd
06-05-2007, 14:17
My English skill very poor
very sorry:cries:

Slaaneshi Slave
06-05-2007, 14:45
Your English is pretty good, it is just HiveFleetEzekial being anal.

Templar Ben
06-05-2007, 15:19
Your English is good.

Cacodemon
06-05-2007, 16:34
My Dark Angels Impossible Wishlist:

- Terminator Command Squad size to 4 Terminators so they fit into a Land Raider with a character (maybe an option for the Deathwing Squad to swap 1 Terminator for Standard and Apothecary upgrades).

- Company Veterans with suspensors on Heavy Bolter, just because of the coolness factor.

- Company Champion without having to have a Company Master, just because Blood Angels get them.

- Dreadnought base cost reduced, but kept the same cost with the Assault Cannon choice.

- Librarian Psychic powers tweak.

deathwing_marine
06-05-2007, 18:33
Pred sponsons are over 50 points. But what the whiners don't tell you is that you can actually field a basic Predator for under 80 pts.

oops sorry, i guess so. i field mine with HB so I didnt really remember. Good call.

HiveFleetEzekial
06-05-2007, 23:35
Your English is pretty good, it is just HiveFleetEzekial being anal.

Try reading some of my *other* posts on much more heated debates. Then you'll see me being anal. (so please don't just assume)

Sorry, I've had the displeasure of deealing with too many 'wannabes' online that use that type of phrasing (and they're all american!). That distracted my attention away from the location feild in his info area. Again, sorry.

(now realizing that info)
Your english *is* pretty good fazzgd. Sorry for jumping on it like I did.

Master Bait
06-05-2007, 23:54
-Allow Scout Sgt a sniper rifle

pretty sure the squad entry says any scout can replace their bolter with a sniper rifle for +5pts, so i'd read that as including the sergeant?

Ronin_eX
07-05-2007, 04:47
Unfortunately not in the DA codex. Though this may change in a FAQ (along with the vet squad sergeant not being able to take any gear).

fazzgd
07-05-2007, 15:34
once again i wrote this change list
it may be stupid but i still post it, i am expecting some useful opinions from you

[HQ]
Interrogator-Chaplain
-Master-Crafted Weapons option Return(pts15)
-Artificer Armour option Return(pts20)

Command Squads
-Company Champion Upgrade cost 5down

[Elites]
Deathwing terminator Squad
-All Deathwing terminator Combi-Weapon option get(10pts)

Dreadnought
-Basic cost 5down
-Twin-linked Lascannon Upgrade cost 10down

Company Veterans Squad
-if there are 10 man of us, Can choose Second Razorback

Techmarines
-Return signum

Scout Squad
-Heavy bolter cost 5down
-missile launcher cost 5down

[Troops]
Tactical Squad
-if there are 10 man of us, Can choose Second Razorback

[Fast Attack]
Assault Squad
-Assault marine plasma pistol Upgrade cost 5down

Ravenwing Attack Squadron
-plasma gun cost 5down
-Attack Bike plasma cannon option get(20pts)

Ravenwing Support Squadron
-Basic cost 5down
-Assault Cannon Upgrade cost 5up

[Heavy support]
Devastator Squad
-if there are 10 man of us, Can choose Second Razorback

Predator
-Side sponsons with Lascannon Upgrade cost 10down

[Vehicle]
Rhino
-Basic cost 5up

Extra Armour
-Basic cost 5down

The Judge
07-05-2007, 16:18
Madness.

The extra armour going down in points is something I would like to see though... 15pts for the Dread armour is a tad much I find.

roachvan
07-05-2007, 17:09
I'd like to see
1. 2 heavy weapons for terminators or assault cannons for terminator down 5pts.
2. ravenwing get jinks and skilled riders back and remove fearless and scout.
3. an option to make regular marines stuborn.

Thommy H
07-05-2007, 17:19
3. an option to make regular marines stuborn.

Why would anyone get Stubborn? Dark Angels use 'Fearless' now.

Pretty much every wish list in this thread might as well be "I wish my army was better than everyone elses".

Yeah, it'd be great if a squad of ten Marines cost 1 point or there was a Strength 10, AP 1, Assault 20 weapon with Rending and Melta that you get for free with every Independent Character or something ridiculous. But that's not how balance works, is it?

roachvan
07-05-2007, 20:18
You do realize that only ravenwing and deathwing are fearless.
the rest of the force will run if given the chance.

HiveFleetEzekial
07-05-2007, 23:06
Don't forget command squads.

And I'm pretty sure he *does* realize that. Stubborn (now Fearless) doesn't fit for the whole chapter. That's his point.

Thommy H
07-05-2007, 23:27
Yeah, you might as well have said "an option for all models to get Mark of Khorne" or whatever - no Dark Angels get Stubborn, so why should the whole army get it?

"Blah blah blah, my army got nerfed" is all this thread is.

Brother Lysander
08-05-2007, 00:23
If it was possible for Jervis to suddenly pop round to mine with a biro to scribble something in my codex that he meant to put in, it would simply be flamers in assault squads. Nothing overwhelming, and I loved the mental image of assault marines dropping out of the sky to unleash some promethium death. I'd also agree with dreads being too costly.

BL

Master Bait
08-05-2007, 02:01
Unfortunately not in the DA codex. Though this may change in a FAQ (along with the vet squad sergeant not being able to take any gear).

sorry, but i never thought we were meant to differentiate between a vet serg scout and just a regular scout in this case - again, as i read it, the serg should be more than welcome to a sniper rifle.

and i think the idea of the vet squad is that it doesn't have a sergeant. they are, instead, a group of experienced veterans working autonomously on the field, not needing to be under the watchful eye of an officer